Sorry Python but it is what it is.

  • Sorry but nah. My last job we had a couple different python microservices. There was pipenv, venv, virtualenv, poetry, Pipfile.lock, requirements.txt (which is only the top level???), just pure madness

    Apparently all this shit is needed because python wants to install shit globally by default? Are you kidding?

    Well, we also had a couple node microservices. Here’s how it went: npm install. Done.

    Afraid you fucked something and want a clean environment? Here’s how you do it with node: delete node_modules/. Done.

    Want a clean python env? Uhhhhhhhh use docker I guess? Maybe try reinstalling Python using homebrew? (real actual answers from the python devs who set these up)

    Well what’s currently installed? ls node_modules, or use npm ls if you want to be fancy.

    In python land? Uhhhhhh

    Let’s update some dep–WHY AREN’T PYTHON PACKAGES USING SEMVER

    So yeah, npm may do some stuff wrong, but it seems like it does way more shit right. Granted I didn’t really put in the effort to figure out all this python shit, but the people who did still didn’t have good answers. And npm is just straightforward and “works”.

    “But JS projects pull in SOOOO many dependencies” Oh boohoo, you have a 1TB SSD anyway.

    • Apparently all this shit is needed because python wants to install shit globally by default?

      None of that was needed. It was just used because nobody at your company enforced a single standard for developing your product.

      Afraid you fucked something and want a clean environment? Here’s how you do it with node: delete node_modules/. Done.

      rm -rf venv/. Done.

      Want a clean python env? Uhhhhhhhh use docker I guess?

      python -m venv venv

      Well what’s currently installed? ls node_modules, or use npm ls if you want to be fancy. In python land? Uhhhhhh

      pip freeze. pip list if you want it formatted.

      Let’s update some dep–WHY AREN’T PYTHON PACKAGES USING SEMVER

      Janky, legacy python packages will have random versioning schemes. If a dependency you’re using doesn’t follow semver I would question why you’re using it and seek out an actively maintained alternative.

        • I really don’t see the hassle… just pick one (e.g. pip/venv) and learn it in like half a day. It took college student me literally a couple hours to figure out how I could distribute a package to my peers that included compiled C++ code using pypi. The hardest part was figuring out how to cross compile the C++ lib. If you think it’s that hard to understand I really don’t know what to tell you…

          • Sure, for a new project. But when inheriting code I’m not in a position to pick.

            The point is that the state of python package managers is a hot fucking mess compared to npm. Claiming that “npm is just as bad” (or worse) honestly seems ridiculous to me.

            (And isn’t pip/venv the one the requirements.txt one? Completely flat, no way to discern the difference between direct dependencies and sub-dependencies? No hashes? Sucks when it’s time for updating? Yeah no thanks, I’d like a proper lock file. Which is probably why there are a dozen other tools.)