One of the tent-poles of Marxism is the idea that actions are driven by material conditions. It seems so obvious to me that the material conditions of a self-appointed vanguard class (regardless of their original intentions) will lead them to be tyrants. “Absolute power corrupts absolutely” as they say.
Vanguards are not “self-appointed,” they are chosen and backed by the broader working class, which is how they have any powwr in the first place. Secondly, the idea that “absolute power corrupts absolutely” is closer to idealism than materialism.
The constituent assembly, the bourgeois institution the workers had already abandoned in favor of the soviet government? Why would anyone hold legitimacy to that? The workers rallied around the bolsheviks, and the SRs backed the overthrow of the state and following the soviets anyways. The bolsheviks had their power from mass support, and because the other groups rallied around them, rather than the SRs, whites, etc.
No? It was the truth. The majority of the faction vote supported overthrowing the constituent assembly and only recognizing the soviet government, which was by that time the government recognized by the working classes. That means that the total of the SRs, Mensheviks, and Bolsheviks voted in outweighed the votes the Right SRs and other factions, and thus support for overthrowing the constituent assembly in favor of the soviets was popular.
Shortly after, the Left SRs and Bolsheviks formed a coalition, and won against the Right SRs among the peasantry, effectively a vote to support the soviet government. After the overthrow of the Tsar, the workers threw the broad majority of their support behind the bolsheviks, with most Left SRs and Mensheviks joining the bolsheviks and the rights split between the whites and the bolsheviks.
I really don’t know what you’re trying to get at, here, do you think the Kerensky government was popular?
Yes, the “truth” as written by Soviet historians afterwards 🙄
The Bolshevik were deeply unpopular and could not claim at all to represent the working class. They only got into power through political maneuvering and outright violence. Maybe at the time they were seen as the lesser evil, but that sure turned out to be a big miscalculation after Lenin started to purge his former political allies.
Source: you made it the fuck up, lmao. Repeating Red Scare fearmongering about the “evil commies” and wielding it like a club, regardless of the truth of the matter, is how you operate. You’ll go to any lengths to disavow socialism in action.
The bolsheviks were chosen because Marxism is correct, and the bolsheviks represented both the workers and the peasantry. The Mensheviks represented only the petite bourgeoisie, the Left SRs were more popular among the peasantry, and the Right SRs supported the outright bourgeoisie. The bolsheviks, on the other hand, were able to unite the workers and peasants soviets and won the Russian Civil War, creating the world’s first socialist state, which managed to:
The bolsheviks were chosen because Marxism is correct
You just sabotaged your last trace of credibility for approaching the subject rationally.
Marxism is a range of discourse that originated with a fallible individual and whose continuation has been by other fallible individuals who naturally are not in full agreement.
It is not an absolute truth or universal solution.
One of the tent-poles of Marxism is the idea that actions are driven by material conditions. It seems so obvious to me that the material conditions of a self-appointed vanguard class (regardless of their original intentions) will lead them to be tyrants. “Absolute power corrupts absolutely” as they say.
Vanguards are not “self-appointed,” they are chosen and backed by the broader working class, which is how they have any powwr in the first place. Secondly, the idea that “absolute power corrupts absolutely” is closer to idealism than materialism.
By a wopping 23.27% after which they decided to just take power anyways.
The constituent assembly, the bourgeois institution the workers had already abandoned in favor of the soviet government? Why would anyone hold legitimacy to that? The workers rallied around the bolsheviks, and the SRs backed the overthrow of the state and following the soviets anyways. The bolsheviks had their power from mass support, and because the other groups rallied around them, rather than the SRs, whites, etc.
Right, that is what Lenin said afterwards to justify this blatant power grab by force. You are really funny 🤡
No? It was the truth. The majority of the faction vote supported overthrowing the constituent assembly and only recognizing the soviet government, which was by that time the government recognized by the working classes. That means that the total of the SRs, Mensheviks, and Bolsheviks voted in outweighed the votes the Right SRs and other factions, and thus support for overthrowing the constituent assembly in favor of the soviets was popular.
Shortly after, the Left SRs and Bolsheviks formed a coalition, and won against the Right SRs among the peasantry, effectively a vote to support the soviet government. After the overthrow of the Tsar, the workers threw the broad majority of their support behind the bolsheviks, with most Left SRs and Mensheviks joining the bolsheviks and the rights split between the whites and the bolsheviks.
I really don’t know what you’re trying to get at, here, do you think the Kerensky government was popular?
Yes, the “truth” as written by Soviet historians afterwards 🙄
The Bolshevik were deeply unpopular and could not claim at all to represent the working class. They only got into power through political maneuvering and outright violence. Maybe at the time they were seen as the lesser evil, but that sure turned out to be a big miscalculation after Lenin started to purge his former political allies.
Source: you made it the fuck up, lmao. Repeating Red Scare fearmongering about the “evil commies” and wielding it like a club, regardless of the truth of the matter, is how you operate. You’ll go to any lengths to disavow socialism in action.
The bolsheviks were very popular, throughout their existence, to the point that George Orwell’s Animal Farm’s main critique is the assumption that the Russian working class simply went along with the bolsheviks because they were too stupid to know any better. Liberals and fascists had to invent conspiracy theories of communist mind control in order to explain the popularity of socialism while painting it as the supreme evil.
The bolsheviks were chosen because Marxism is correct, and the bolsheviks represented both the workers and the peasantry. The Mensheviks represented only the petite bourgeoisie, the Left SRs were more popular among the peasantry, and the Right SRs supported the outright bourgeoisie. The bolsheviks, on the other hand, were able to unite the workers and peasants soviets and won the Russian Civil War, creating the world’s first socialist state, which managed to:
The bolsheviks weren’t a “lesser evil,” they were immensely popular, to the point that today the vast majority of those still alive that lived in the USSR want it back.
You just sabotaged your last trace of credibility for approaching the subject rationally.
Marxism is a range of discourse that originated with a fallible individual and whose continuation has been by other fallible individuals who naturally are not in full agreement.
It is not an absolute truth or universal solution.
My god are you naive 🤦
🤡 🐝