“You didn’t like what I was doing? No fucking problem I’ll just lie about it moving forward”
Having read the article, some points from the dev make sense, but also he acted like a princess by the end, so a bit of a messy situation.
I’ll be uninstalling tonight.
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More specifically, it means they made commits with it. If you use it but commit yourself there’s no coauthored.
Or just add a note to your memory md…
I just removed Lutris and tried out Bottles last night. How have I never tried it before? It’s so good!
I’m not gonna lie, Lutris is fucking terrible. Basic QOL things are missing. There’s so many disjointed ways of doing so many things. The same 2-5 things need to be set every time you add an app and it’s basically all manual because they have done nothing to make it better. There’s thousands and switches and options, and the only way to find information about what they do is to hit the web… and then you find out so many of them are probably useless.
There’s built in install scripts for things but trying to figure out any information about them within the program itself is also useless.
Then there’s the shit that just doesn’t work. Other tools like Heroic Games Launcher are the only way to install games from providers like epic. You can spend hours troubleshooting this in Lutris, and maybe even get an epic game to install and run once… but everything is going to be a broken mess on try 2.
Just a disappointing app all around once you really start working with it. It’s a shame it seems to be the default mode wine app manager.
Speaking of install scripts, their refusal to version them for “reasons” was my first hint that the project wasn’t in a healthy state.
Oh poop, been using lutris and it was pretty good at what it was doing for me. What might be alternatives though?
Heroic has been my go to for everything outside of my Steam library.
Heroic. Bottles for the rest.
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Lord Almighty the reactionary hate is so goddamn stupid.
I actually dont see the fucking problem. Let them develop it way they want. People will tell if it’s good or not.
The problem is installing buggy clanker code on thousands of systems where the experience level is “I like games”
Ethics objections aside, dude said he’s not even reviewing some of the code the AI generates. At least leave the markers where it shows which code is what so proper scrutiny can be given.
Lutris dev is a straight up crybaby and needs to learn to a) read a room and b) not take risks with other people’s systems to stroke his own fucking ego.
Fucking bitchmade shit.
At this point I guess we’re just assuming it’s “buggy” due to the IA, right? You guys just have to accept that these tools will do better job than humans in the near future, at least for basic or intermediate programming. It’s going to get better that it is today and we’re going to have to live with it. I agree on marking the code. That should be necessary. Besides that, I really don’t care about the dev. As I said before no one is forcing us to use Lutris.
At this point I guess we’re just assuming it’s “buggy” due to the IA, right?
No. But it might be. We don’t know because the guy who’s supposed to double check, isn’t. And admits to it like its some kind of brag.
There also the whole debate around licensing. Generative images have been called “art laundering”, and the same can be argued for code.
It’s a potential way to break FOSS licenses. Just copy the code and have an AI re-implement what it does, and boom you get to ignore license obligations.
Never used that shit.
“Add non-Steam game”
That is generally the approach I use, but some games take a bit more setup. I play StarCraft2 for Archipelago and I needed to install it with this app to get the proper script to get it to run successfully. What this app has that Steam doesn’t is the ability for people to create, export, and share custom install and launch profiles for others to use.
With that said I will need to see what Heroic Launcher has to offer.
Ahhh, that is useful.
I used a bit of Heroic and liked it, I hope it fills your needs!
Whether or not I use Claude is not going to change society, this requires changes at a deeper level, and we all know that nothing is going to improve with the current US administration.
I mean yeah, that’s true. Why waste energy harassing developers of libre software for using AI? That’s not going to have any impact on big tech.
This is not about big tech, its about lutris apparently being maintained by an idiot with no regard for code quality, safety or community interests.
People simply do not want AI. They don’t want to look at AI “art”, don’t want to listen to AI “music”, don’t want to read AI “books” and don’t want to use AI slopware.
This is both a matter of quality and, more importantly, principles.
And I think it’s safe to say that people in the open source community are more ideological than most. Finding out that a project is relying on exploitative corporate slop of an unknown origin is like the hippy going to the farmer’s market only to find that the guy selling “his local organic free-range cage-free” eggs is just buying factory shit from the supermarket.
I didn’t think anyone blames the Lutris guy for AI at large.
But people are passionate about things and they don’t want to support a project that they perceive is being thoughtlessly programmed, exploiting the labor of others, violating the letter or the spirit of the GPL, supporting a corrupt industry, etc.
Thank you. It’s so infuriating to come into threads like this to find “If you don’t like it, do it yourself” and shit like that. All it does is remove blame from the person making an ignorant decision, and place it on those rightfully upset because “Maybe the dev wouldn’t have been forced to use the environment destroying plagiarism machine if you have been more generous with your time.”
Yeah. But ultimately people will have to fork Lutris, or just use something else (like Faugus, Bottles, Steam, etc.), if they don’t like how things are being run.
Oh for sure, that’s one the benefits of open source stuff, you can do that in the first place. I just mean that seeing blame be misplaced gets under my skin, especially when it comes from such a disingenuous place.
Oh man I love having CVE 9 vulnerabilities in my system
Update: not hiding it anymore. https://github.com/lutris/lutris/discussions/6530#discussioncomment-16107836
No reason to hide the Claude contributions if his reasoning isn’t flawed. Honestly, my biggest beef is using AI as a subscription service, there are plenty of local LLM alternatives, and that just feeds the incentive for the web crawlers currently assaulting the Internet, for the companies also tucking in surveillance and training on your use of their AI.
Honestly, it can save you having to search through wordy API documentation, as long as you bother to make sure to make sure you end up knowing the hows and whys of what it is presenting you and whether it is good programming methodology. In a lot of ways it is no different and even faster than having to search for the answers through support forums and stack overflow. It might be built upon IP theft, but unfortunately in practical terms, you will be at a disadvantage against people that use it, so you might as well use it in a way that does not give them any way to profit off of it (Local LLMs). I’d argue that the case against these applications of generative AI is way different than those for image and video generation.
The biggest problem is when developers begin to depend on it too much without learning the nuance, but it would be a lie if there aren’t a lot of developers who contribute to Open Source without really bothering to familiarize with it already and who are more interested in the end goal than best practices. Not sure if this will make the problem better or worse, but devs who use AI without bothering to learn will have a hell of a time providing proper maintenance for their code.
Not disagreeing with you, but Anthropic believes code is the path to AGI.
I want to be clear so somebody doesn’t have a fit - I do not personally believe LLMs are capable of AGI. But this isn’t about what I believe.
They believe that coding is the path because it’s verifiable and a generatable. Frontier AI companies aren’t training on the global internet anymore, it’s poisoned with AI slop. Non-frontier AI companies do, we’ve all seen it. But it’s my opinion that non frontier AI companies are basically all but irrelevant (I’m not talking about open source/hugging face). Anthropic knows this, and their idea (again, not mine, don’t get mad at me please!) is that by training on code their AI will get better at non-coding activities as well, and if they make it good enough at coding it’ll become truly intelligent in all ways.
What I’m getting at is, there’s lots of good reasons to avoid using LLMs/AIs/Companies that shove ai down my throat (looking at you Microsoft- I don’t fucking want copilot in my fucking notepad - if anybody from MS is reading this fuck your AI in everything and fuck your AI ridden operating system), but local LLMs are not a replacement for Opus and Anthropic isn’t scraping the open internet anymore. I’m sure they did at first though.
The biggest problem is when developers begin to depend on it too much without learning the nuance I couldn’t agree more. The brain is like a muscle, if you use it, it gets stronger. If you don’t, it gets weaker. “Vibe” coding is using your brain at a minimum, and if all you do is vibe out slop you’re not really learning much.
local LLMs are not a replacement for Opus
https://www.bitdoze.com/best-open-source-llms-claude-alternative/
Something tells me you haven’t even made the effort. They are not that good, in the same way that LibreOffice is not as good as Excel. But if you are going to make the argument you quote, then you can work that brain muscle and adapt.
And they aren’t training off of the Internet because they are training on your input. It’s mind-boggling to me how some people are so willing to train their replacements while also paying them for the effort to do so for an advantage set very temporary in the future we are heading. A lot of your criticism doesn’t even apply to local LLMs - either they are trained by model distillation from more advances models or because they are images temporally set in stone. It’s also telling how implicitly willing you seem to be able to let the Internet burn, because the inevitability is becoming a corporate slave and accepting their ever increasing subscription fees which you can’t ignore because “hey, they’ve got the most users, the Internet is too dead, your open alternatives are no replacements for us”. You say you are not, but you are saying everything an AI AGI astrosurfer would be saying, and the irony of hearing this in an open source “federated” platform over something like Reddit is paramount.
I could have worded that differently, I apologize.
They aren’t a replacement for somebody like me who doesn’t have a screaming GPU.
Yes they train on input. I don’t like it either. It’s not just creepy, but I’m sure breaks privacy laws everywhere.
Regardless, you’ve already decided who I am so I don’t see this conversation being productive.
I again apologize for not making my previous comment more straightforward.
Oh, I don’t think I know who you are, I just think it’s indiscernible.
They aren’t a replacement for somebody like me who doesn’t have a screaming GPU.
You can run small LLMs that are still surprisingly good purely on modern CPUs, although I’m sure that’s part of the intent of trying to lock down supplies behind the bubble.
If you don’t believe me or you don’t get it, it doesn’t matter.
It’s only slop if you don’t know what you’re doing and/or are using low quality tools. But I have over 30 years of programming experience and use the best tool currently available. It was tremendously helpful in helping me catch up with everything I wasn’t able to do last year because of health issues / depression.
It sounds like they thought it through and decided it’s the best way to do the work. Removing the attributions seems like a little bit of a petty “fuck you”, but so is opening a github issue just to whine about AI. Someone who is volunteering their time to make free software shouldn’t have to put up with people with an ideological bone to pick who feel entitled to tell them how.
Then they can ignore the issue just like plenty of other troll ones that devs ignore. He actually had to invest effort into doing what he did than just ignoring it, never mind how that Barbara Streissanded it . Honestly would have been better for the guy if he wasn’t doing advertising for Claude by letting it mark the parts of the code it had coauthored, but once the cat is out of the bag you can’t just take something like that back. I agree that if people really have a problem with it, then they should just fork and do it on their own time, but you have to expect public criticism if you do things in the public, otherwise don’t.
Got it, so block any further updates till there’s a backtrack or a fork.
Lutris has always been a pain in the ass to use. Nothing I set up worked properly. Manually setting things up via Proton has worked just fine for me, so nothing of value was lost with this fiasco.
I’ve been using Faugus and it just works. Every time I try Lutris I get upset.
