I had someone steel this and change “butts” to “Christian” and weirdly enough, lengthen my skirt. Kept the flame boots, but no short skirts.
MrMonkey ( @MrMonkey@lemm.ee ) 33•11 months agoToo many people would change their minds based on what the sign says.
Does you reaction change if the sign read: “Black Lives Matter” or if it read “Back the Blue”?
Or one that says “Trans women are women” vs “trans women aren’t women”?
Or “pineapple on pizza is ok” vs “pinapple on pizza is the work of the devil”?
koorool ( @koorool@feddit.de ) 20•11 months agoWe must not be tolerant to intolerance is the basis for me.
reverendz ( @reverendz@lemmy.ml ) 4•11 months agoTolerance is not a moral precept, it’s a peace treaty
Fantastic read on this. Reader view worked for me.
button_masher ( @button_masher@lemmy.ml ) 2•11 months agoThank you for that. Really informative and a fun read.
NightAuthor ( @NightAuthor@beehaw.org ) 6•11 months agoI think I’m still of the mind that “intent to incite violence” is the line. And even that can be crossed when the government needs to be overthrown.
But I could be convinced otherwise
PowerCrazy ( @PowerCrazy@lemmy.ml ) 4•11 months agoViolence is extremely useful and will be the only tool you have left if you want to stop climate change or protect yourself+your social network from the effects of capitalism.
nik282000 ( @nik282000@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoI think climate change is beyond the point of violence. The number of people, corporations, and equipment involved in the production and consumption of fossil fuels is beyond what non-military action could take on. Not to mention you have to get people to filter between useful petrochemical products (medical supplies) and problematic ones (god damned plastic bags, mylar balloons, fuckin solo cups) and not just arson us back to the stone-age.
Things are gonna suck for a long time before they get better.
hglman ( @hglman@lemmy.ml ) English1•11 months agoYou’re going to get violence anyway you want it to go down.
nik282000 ( @nik282000@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoIdeally political leaders will get the cocks out of their asses and realize that their children and grand-children WILL suffer through the most unusual chapter in human history. For sure it wont be the what most people go through but there will be a noticeable reduction the the quality of life for everyone.
hglman ( @hglman@lemmy.ml ) English1•11 months agoPolitical leaders, especially in the anglosphere, have no interests beyond self-enrichment.
OurToothbrush ( @OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml ) 3•11 months agoGood things and bad things are different actually
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 31•11 months agoLet’s replace the word with “N*****” and see if you still feel clever
Nalivai ( @Nalivai@discuss.tchncs.de ) 19•11 months agoLet’s replace some of the words in your comment to “I am a pooopoo head and I eat poopoo”, and see how do you feel then. Bet pretty stupid, huh?
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 8•11 months agoExcellent rebuttal.
Numuruzero ( @Numuruzero@lemmy.dbzer0.com ) 15•11 months agoThe point still stands, in the minutiae you’re addressing. People post absolute garbage opinions on a regular basis, and are free to do so, as long as their platform allows it. This doesn’t go into the consequences of pissing off a lot of people, but you’re still free to do it.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 9•11 months agoThe point does not stand. I don’t think any set of rules that sees “N***** N***** N*****” as acceptable speech should be respected, nor any person who thinks that way.
Numuruzero ( @Numuruzero@lemmy.dbzer0.com ) 9•11 months agoI agree with the spirit, but I disagree with what the point of the comic is - it’s not trying to make a point about respect per se, just about freedom of speech. Even if you wouldn’t be a part of a community that allows hate speech, if you encounter it “in the street” so to speak - there’s just nothing you can do.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 2•11 months agoI know it’s saying that, and I think that’s bullshit.
MrMonkey ( @MrMonkey@lemm.ee ) 2•11 months agobullshit how?
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 3•11 months agoI think it’s a defeatist attitude that allows hatred to fester.
R00bot ( @R00bot@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 13•11 months agoYou can’t see the difference between “butts” and the n word?
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 20•11 months agoThe point is, this argument doesn’t hold up.
Duamerthrax ( @Duamerthrax@lemmy.ml ) 12•11 months agoBecause it’s a short comic, it doesn’t have the time to go into the nuances. One word has a long history of being used to dehumanize an “other” group and the other just a word for a body part. If body parts offend you as much as racial slurs, you may have your own issues.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 10•11 months agoStill missing the point
If this logic can be used to defend race hate, then maybe the logic isn’t sound
Also, if the issue is too nuanced for you to convey in a short comic, maybe don’t make a short comic about it
Duamerthrax ( @Duamerthrax@lemmy.ml ) 9•11 months agoIf the only argument against something is that it’s offensive and they can’t rationalize it at all, the argument can be thrown out. That’s all the comic is about.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 6•11 months agoThat’s just rationalisation. To me, this comic highlights the absurd logic of bigots and free speech absolutists. “Offensive to everyone” is an impossible standard to meet; bigots are obviously never going to be offended by bigotry, so even hate speech doesn’t meet that threshold.
Also, it’s never just “butts”, and it’s never just a single person, so it’s a bit of a misrepresentation.
Duamerthrax ( @Duamerthrax@lemmy.ml ) 4•11 months agoBigots can’t rationalize their bigotry. At least not in a way that can’t be torn apart. They always end up using circular logic, which is what the comic is address.
I’m “offended” at racism because it creates an unsafe culture for everyone involved. I can cit research about the effects of generational racism leading to higher crime for instance.
They’re offended at the sight of black people being able to use the same water fountain as them. They can’t tell me why, which is why their argument ends at their “offense” and is the scenario the comic is about.
Also, it’s never just “butts”
I’ve seen people online get offended at the bumper sticker “Fuck Cancer”.
R00bot ( @R00bot@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 1•11 months agoThe argument isn’t about racial slurs.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 5•11 months agoI’m gonna need you to engage in just a little more abstract thinking for me. I’m not talking about racism either.
Let’s try another thing instead: “Got hates fags”
How about: “Jews did 9/11”
It’s pretty easy to say “free speech! I can say whatever I like!! I’m not responsible for your hurt feelings!” without any nuance, but speech is a bit more complicated than that.
R00bot ( @R00bot@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 2•11 months agoThe cartoon isn’t about free speech absolutism. It’s just about offensive stuff. All the things you said are hate speech.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 4•11 months agoIt contains the single most popular defence of free speech absolutism
R00bot ( @R00bot@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 1•11 months agoIt’s from a website called TheDevilsPanties bro. I get where you’re coming from but it’s clearly about book bannings/conservatives getting upset with content in movies/books/signs/etc. The comic doesn’t explicitly say it’s excluding hate speech but it shouldn’t have to.
pirate fish ( @saltedFish@discuss.tchncs.de ) 2•11 months agoAbstract thinking is impossible for some people it seems
OurToothbrush ( @OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml ) 4•11 months agoSaying good things and saying bad things are different actually
TimewornTraveler ( @TimewornTraveler@lemm.ee ) 4•11 months agobut that’s not the message of the comic
OurToothbrush ( @OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoI think you’re missing the point. You have to take it in the context it was written in.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 2•11 months agoUm, what?
OurToothbrush ( @OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoWhat it says on the tin.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 2•11 months agoCare to elaborate on how it relates to my comment?
OurToothbrush ( @OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoDefending free speech that says good things is different than defending free speech that is just being racist. The implication of hypocrisy that you’re suggesting with your comment doesn’t really work unless you view all speech as equivalent, which it self evidently isn’t.
irmoz ( @irmoz@reddthat.com ) 3•11 months agoDefending free speech that says good things is different than defending free speech that is just being racist.
That’s kinda the point I’m making, though. This argument is not nuanced enough, because the only standard it sets is that for something to be truly offensive, it must “offend everyone”. This is an absurd and impossible standard.
The implication of hypocrisy that you’re suggesting with your comment doesn’t really work unless you view all speech as equivalent, which it self evidently isn’t.
I didn’t say anything about hypocrisy. I just said that the argument presented is insufficient.
OurToothbrush ( @OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoIf you include the context it isnt insufficient. It is also a short comic.
richyawyingtmv ( @richyawyingtmv@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoReal life footage of this actually happening, and the result: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8DJGw3rIwI
NightAuthor ( @NightAuthor@beehaw.org ) 1•11 months agoReal life footage?
Wow richyawyingtmv ( @richyawyingtmv@lemmy.ml ) 1•11 months agoYeah it was the same day as that massive gold heist.
Duamerthrax ( @Duamerthrax@lemmy.ml ) 23•11 months agoStephen Fry on being offended.
Note, Mr Fry is a gay man and has championed gay rights. His very existence is offensive to backwards conservatives. This quote often gets shared without any context.
TimewornTraveler ( @TimewornTraveler@lemm.ee ) 13•11 months agowhat year is this, 2015?
Rob Bos ( @rbos@lemmy.ca ) 4•11 months agoHave always enjoyed your comics, funny story.