Elon lied about the monkeys — and he shouldn’t be trusted to put his Neuralink chips in human brains.
“They are claiming they are going to put a safe device on the market, and that’s why you should invest,” Ryan Merkley at the Physicians Committee, told Wired. “And we see his lie as a way to whitewash what happened in these exploratory studies.”
Really heartbreaking reading what happened to the monkeys.
People quite rightly think of Elizabeth Holmes as a fraud for making false medical claims about what the Theranos machines could do. So why aren’t Elon’s claims at Neuralink being held to the same level of scrutiny?
https://futurism.com/neoscope/terrible-things-monkeys-neuralink-implants
Lmaydev ( @Lmaydev@programming.dev ) 93•2 years agoLet’s not pretend Musk has fucking clue what’s going on or the science behind it.
He isn’t down in trenches making discoveries. That’s just the image he presents.
He buys companies and lets the actually competent people do the work while claiming credit.
He’s been doing it since PayPal.
He’s not a genius, he just has enough money to get actual geniuses to work for him.
maegul (he/they) ( @maegul@lemmy.ml ) English50•2 years agoSomeone put it well, if insensitively, about Sam Bankman Fried (FTX etc):
Not actually smart but just LARP-ing the “Aspy genius” persona.
However accurate that take is or offensive, I think it captures something about how nerd culture has gone mainstream and how it’s perceived.
Piers ( @Piers@beehaw.org ) English18•2 years agoHe buys companies and lets the actually competent people do the work while claiming credit.
No he doesn’t. He meddles and interferes constantly and convinces himself that he’s adding value by doing so. That’s why Neuralink is dangerous. Meta or Alphabet or Microsoft or whoever can be trusted to let the scientists and the legal team ensure there’s very little risk of everything blowing up in their face horribly. Elon’s little empire is constantly on the verge of an absolute disaster. I would not be remotely surprised if Neuralink messes everything up so much that it sets back brain implants and BCI’s in general by decades. Purely because Elon can’t just supply the people at his businesses with the tools they need then get out of their way.
Dizzy Devil Ducky ( @AceFuzzLord@lemm.ee ) English1•2 years agoI’m hoping this becomes another Chernobyl type incident where instead of people being against nuclear energy, it’s people against brain implants over the fear of how dangerous they are. At least for the implants that are not made specifically as medical devices that help instead of dumb people down with forced ads and memes.
kent_eh ( @kent_eh@lemmy.ca ) English17•2 years agoHe buys companies and lets the actually competent people do the work while claiming credit.
Sometimes he actively interferes with those competent people too.
Ray McCarthy ( @raymccarthy@historians.social ) 4•2 years ago@Lmaydev @ajsadauskas
Peter Thiel sacked him as a PayPal boss?
He didn’t “invent” Paypal. Lmaydev ( @Lmaydev@programming.dev ) 17•2 years agoIt was formed by merging his company X with Confinity. All he did was profit off it but many people seem to think he created it.
Piers ( @Piers@beehaw.org ) English7•2 years agoTo be clear, he did try to make them use his own work instead and it was awful so they pushed him out to protect the company.
JokeDeity ( @JokeDeity@lemm.ee ) 5•2 years agoLMFAO, I had no idea this wasn’t even the first time he called his dumb company X. He really is obsessed with that letter.
NattyNatty2x4 ( @NattyNatty2x4@beehaw.org ) 4•2 years agoX.com, SpaceX, now changing Twitter to X. Dude has an obsession
JokeDeity ( @JokeDeity@lemm.ee ) 4•2 years agoDon’t forget his dumbass name for his child.
Lmaydev ( @Lmaydev@programming.dev ) 3•2 years agoHe was just looking for a reason to use the domain name I’m pretty sure.
Ray McCarthy ( @raymccarthy@historians.social ) 42•2 years ago@ajsadauskas @technology
I was astounded to read Neuralink is to be permitted to experiment on humans. Instead they should have any animal experiment licences revoked. 🎓 Dr. Freemo :jpf: 🇳🇱 ( @freemo@qoto.org ) 0•2 years agoWhy? We already have brain interface links that do similar damage to neuralink, this isnt unusual or unexpected. In its current form it is rightfully used on terminal patients with locked-in syndom. In other words, people before it damaged their brain in a meaningful way and whom cant be further paralyzed.
It would give these people a chance at someinteraction with the real world… What happened with the monkeys was about in line with other neural interfaces, its a consequence of the limits of the tech not negligence.
MiddledAgedGuy ( @MiddledAgedGuy@beehaw.org ) 37•2 years agoWhenever I see these Musk posts, I always think the title can usually be reduced to 3 or 4 words. In this case, “Elon shouldn’t be trusted”.
BaconIsAVeg ( @BaconIsAVeg@lemmy.ml ) English16•2 years agoWhenever I see these Musk posts, I always marvel at how people seem to think one man builds spaceships, programs self-driving cars, pushes all the buttons on Twitter, and does all the research himself on monkeys.
MiddledAgedGuy ( @MiddledAgedGuy@beehaw.org ) 4•2 years agoAlso true.
InternetUser2012 ( @InternetUser2012@midwest.social ) 10•2 years ago‘Elon CAN’T be trusted.’
Spzi ( @Spzi@lemm.ee ) English32•2 years agoHeadline:
TERRIBLE THINGS HAPPENED TO MONKEYS AFTER GETTING NEURALINK IMPLANTS, ACCORDING TO VETERINARY RECORDS
What are these terrible things?
Up to a dozen monkeys suffered grisly fates after receiving a Neuralink implant, including brain swelling and partial paralysis.
First is the case of the monkey “Animal 20.” In December 2019, an internal part of the brain implant being inserted into the primate “broke off” during surgery. Later that night, the monkey scratched at the implant site, drawing blood, and yanked on the implant, partially dislodging it. Follow-up surgery discovered that the wound was infected, but that the placement of the implant prevented treatment. The monkey was euthanized the next month.
Before that, a female monkey designated “Animal 15” began to press her head against the ground after receiving the brain implant, pick at the site until it bled, and eventually lost coordination, shivering when personnel entered the room. Scientists discovered she had brain bleeding, and in March 2019, she too was euthanized.
The following year, a primate called “Animal 22” was put down in March 2020 after its brain implant became so loose that the screws attaching it to the skull “could easily be lifted out,” according to a necropsy report.
“The failure of this implant can be considered purely mechanical and not exacerbated by infection,” the necropsy states.
As Wired notes, that statement alone seemingly contradicts Musk’s claims that no monkeys directly died from Neuralink brain implants.
And so would the account of an ex-Neuralink employee, who told Wired that Musk’s claims that the monkeys were already terminally ill are “ridiculous,” even a “straight-up fabrication.”
“We had these monkeys for a year or so before any surgery was performed,” the ex-employee said.
The testimony of an anonymous scientist conducting research at CNPRC seems to corroborate the ex-employee’s allegations.
“These are pretty young monkeys,” they told the magazine. “It’s hard to imagine these monkeys, who were not adults, were terminal for some reason.”
TehPers ( @TehPers@beehaw.org ) English1•2 years agoWhat the hell. I feel bad for reading that, holy crap. That’s some nightmare fuel.
rood ( @rood@aus.social ) 15•2 years ago@ajsadauskas @technology I was just going to ask the Theranos/Holmes question.
jonne ( @jonne@infosec.pub ) 6•2 years agoOnce he’ll start losing investors’ money his lies will catch up to him. Nobody’s asking questions as long as line goes up.
Nuncio Bitis ✷ ✅ ( @nuncio@mstdn.social ) 0•2 years ago jonne ( @jonne@infosec.pub ) 2•2 years agoSBF, Holmes, that woman that faked having 30m users on her platform, etc. And Trump never fooled most people, he’s been known to be a con man since the 80s to anyone that’s been paying attention.
Aviandelight ( @Aviandelight@mander.xyz ) 6•2 years agoTheranos went down because Holmes was trying to run the same tired start-up scam all the big boys pull but within the confines of the medical industry. She would have succeeded if she had picked something non medical. The FDA doesn’t fuck around. If Elon thinks he’s smart enough to pull the same shit he’s going to “find out” too.
magnetosphere ( @HappyMeatbag@beehaw.org ) English4•2 years agoI really, really hope this is the case. I’d love to see him pay some serious consequences, especially if it’s the result of his own arrogance.
Piers ( @Piers@beehaw.org ) English1•2 years agoI just hope there aren’t too many consequences for other people along with it.
utopiah ( @utopiah@lemmy.ml ) 1•2 years agoSupposedly the FAA doesn’t fuck around and yet he managed quite alright with SpaceX, cf https://www.techwontsave.us/episode/186_spacexs_regulatory_evasion_has_consequences_w_eric_roesch
Stuka ( @Stuka@lemmy.ml ) 15•2 years agoI feel like this is all a given. How they’re legally able to proceed with human testing is just baffling to me.
InternetUser2012 ( @InternetUser2012@midwest.social ) 5•2 years ago$$$$$$$$$
Auli ( @Auli@lemmy.ca ) English4•2 years agoBeing rich nothing else matters in America.
Jeramee ( @Jeramee@mastodon.social ) 14•2 years agoElon has a history of lying that’s as rich as he was before he bought Twitter.
morningrise ( @morningrise@lemmy.ml ) 13•2 years agoI think Elmo should just volunteer himself.
SouthEndSunset ( @SouthEndSunset@lemm.ee ) 11•2 years agoDoesnt that guy lie about everything?
some_guy ( @some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org ) 10•2 years agoHe’s a lying piece of shit. Full stop.
Anti Gravity ( @antigravy@universeodon.com ) 9•2 years ago@ajsadauskas @technology
We should have stopped Dr Evil before he got his phony doctorate.Didn’t we already go through this with Whatsername and her fake blood tests?
plistig ( @plistig@feddit.de ) 7•2 years agoDidn’t we already go through this with Whatsername and her fake blood tests?
Maybe read more than the title before commenting? I know, it’s a novel concept.
People quite rightly think of Elizabeth Holmes as a fraud for making false medical claims about what the Theranos machines could do. So why aren’t Elon’s claims at Neuralink being held to the same level of scrutiny?
teuast ( @teuast@lemmy.ca ) 1•2 years agoI mean, to answer their question, yes.
I suspect they were well aware of that and were being tongue-in-cheek.
David Treloar ( @trelord75@aus.social ) 7•2 years agoThat’s horrible, and also confirms what I said just the other day, who would trust him putting an implant in your brain, not me, and I already have brain damage.
David Treloar ( @trelord75@aus.social ) 5•2 years agoAlso does this remind of some news not that far back about the doomed titanic sub, similar story, ignorance of reality, shortcuts, and then failure.
Same thing, and he wants to test with people, this is just crazy, he should never be given the right to do so.
Ray McCarthy ( @raymccarthy@historians.social ) 2•2 years ago@trelord75 @ajsadauskas @technology
Thai caves sub proposal was crazy. David Treloar ( @trelord75@aus.social ) 1•2 years agoYeah I’m regularly missing words these days, your brain should fill them in as they aren’t important words really, just link filler ones to make it sound right.
Ah well, what can I do, constantly edit everything I guess, but I get lazy.
David Treloar ( @trelord75@aus.social ) 2•2 years agoIn this thread, I talked about it.
Piers ( @Piers@beehaw.org ) English1•2 years agoI wouldn’t trust a sandwich made by one of his companies.
RealGene ☣️ ( @RealGene@mastodon.online ) 6•2 years ago@ajsadauskas @technology
The only reason something happened to Deep Voice Barbie was because some Very Important People were publicly embarrassed by their association with, and gullibility of her. Margot Robbie ( @MargotRobbie@lemm.ee ) 1•2 years agoNote to self: great idea for throwaway gag in inevitable sequel.
LAUREN ( @noondlyt@mastodon.social ) 6•2 years ago@ajsadauskas @autolycos @technology Because he has the most money. Because any who should hold him accountable have their hand in his pocket. Because he has government contracts with every single one of his businesses. He is a monster created by those who are supposed to protect us from the monsters. It is not remotely possible to control him. He is the worst case scenario.