- eksb ( @eksb@programming.dev ) English79•1 month ago
How much AI do you want in your browser:
( ) None
( ) Zero
( ) I want my browser to automatically close any page that mentions AI
- Thann ( @Thann@lemmy.ml ) English40•1 month ago
Which of these options do you prefer:
( ) having an AI assistant integrated into the browser
( ) getting kicked in the balls by elon musk
- NauticalNoodle ( @NauticalNoodle@lemmy.ml ) 7•1 month ago
A genuinely tough decision
- umbrella ( @umbrella@lemmy.ml ) 4•1 month ago
i guess daddy musk is coming to make my dreams come true
- Scrubbles ( @scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech ) English12•1 month ago
hi we’re the marketing team and we already decided what we want to do, and we can make up whatever data you want to see for us to justify it!
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English6•1 month ago
More like
-
2x slower browser
-
AI
-
- Chloé 🥕 ( @carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 50•1 month ago
i don’t like how they used “want least”, it means three very different things:
- i want this but it’s not the thing i want the most
- i don’t care for this
- oh god fuck no
- verdigris ( @verdigris@lemmy.ml ) 9•1 month ago
That’s why they did it in sets of three. They could just give every user a blank text box for every option, but doing it this way makes it far easier to analyze the data in bulk.
- Chloé 🥕 ( @carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 4•1 month ago
yea, but that gives you less info
this way, you can’t really differentiate from a feature that people want, but not as a priority, VS a feature that people don’t want ever
- jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 2•1 month ago
It makes the survey easier to complete by users in small steps. Huge surveys scare users away.
- Vincent ( @Vincent@feddit.nl ) 4•1 month ago
The survey design accounts for this. See https://lemm.ee/comment/13835466.
- jet ( @jet@hackertalks.com ) English46•1 month ago
What country do you live in: Germany, United States, Brazil, other
What? Weird survey options.
- thingsiplay ( @thingsiplay@beehaw.org ) 7•1 month ago
Very weird, because it’s not sorted alphabetically. That means there is a bias in the sorting, because the first option is default and the best option for most users.
- kbal ( @kbal@fedia.io ) 8•1 month ago
They are sorted at random for each visitor.
- thingsiplay ( @thingsiplay@beehaw.org ) 3•1 month ago
Oh I meant this as a joke, to place Germany as the best answer.^^ But regardless, good to know its random. Probably doesn’t even matter.
- mryessir ( @mryessir@lemmy.sdf.org ) 3•1 month ago
𝔅𝔦𝔱𝔱𝔢 𝔣𝔬𝔯𝔪𝔲𝔩𝔦𝔢𝔯𝔢𝔫 𝔖𝔦𝔢 ℑ𝔥𝔯𝔢 𝔎𝔯𝔦𝔱𝔦𝔨 𝔞𝔫 𝔡𝔢𝔯 𝔅𝔲𝔫𝔡𝔢𝔰𝔯𝔢𝔭𝔲𝔟𝔩𝔦𝔨 𝔇𝔢𝔲𝔱𝔰𝔠𝔥𝔩𝔞𝔫𝔡 𝔭𝔯ä𝔷𝔦𝔰𝔢 𝔲𝔫𝔡 𝔨𝔬𝔫𝔰𝔱𝔯𝔲𝔨𝔱𝔦𝔳. 𝔄𝔫𝔡𝔢𝔯𝔫𝔣𝔞𝔩𝔩𝔰 𝔪ü𝔰𝔰𝔢𝔫 𝔴𝔦𝔯 𝔖𝔦𝔢 𝔞𝔲𝔣 𝔢𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔏𝔦𝔰𝔱𝔢 𝔰𝔢𝔱𝔷𝔢𝔫. 𝔉𝔞𝔵 𝔦𝔰𝔱 𝔴𝔞𝔯𝔪 𝔲𝔫𝔡 𝔟𝔢𝔱𝔯𝔦𝔢𝔟𝔰𝔟𝔢𝔯𝔢𝔦𝔱, 𝔜𝔞𝔫𝔨𝔢𝔢.
- adarza ( @adarza@lemmy.ca ) English5•1 month ago
could just be the countries with the most users or where they’ve seen a recent trend, up or down, in local market share.
- communism ( @communism@lemmy.ml ) 3•1 month ago
I didn’t see that question, but all 3 of those countries seem to rank pretty high on the country demographics for FOSS that I’ve seen (as in when individual FOSS projects do demographics surveys of their users)
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English1•1 month ago
It has always been
- RobotToaster ( @RobotToaster@mander.xyz ) 39•1 month ago
Which of the following attributes would you most want your new browser to have, and which would you want least?
Twice as slow as your current browser
Is that a joke?
- Liome ( @Liome@pawb.social ) 35•1 month ago
Control question probably, to check if you actually read the questions.
- thingsiplay ( @thingsiplay@beehaw.org ) 9•1 month ago
Makes sense. What about those who click that option as a joke? Maybe discount all other replies from that person because of that too?
- tetris11 ( @tetris11@lemmy.ml ) 11•1 month ago
I mean, fair?
- ReversalHatchery ( @ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org ) English5•1 month ago
Or what if they don’t click it by joke, but because they actually prefer a 2x slower browser over such a feature?
lol, yeah. 👍
I was doing a political poll just the other day and the third or fourth question was a color question like: “Which of the following is associated most with a ripe banana?”
- tiredofsametab ( @tiredofsametab@kbin.run ) 1•1 month ago
I debated because I really disliked another option in there (I think it was split-screen for AI or something stupid) and it felt like it was designed to make me not rank something else I didn’t like as least desired.
- Tacoma ( @Tacoma@feddit.org ) 17•1 month ago
For me that was together with
A privacy-respecting AI assistant that makes your browser smarter by learning how you use it
So I don’t really care how slow the browser is, as long as it doesn’t have an AI “assistant” that is monitoring my browser usage
- RobotToaster ( @RobotToaster@mander.xyz ) 3•1 month ago
I wouldn’t mind an AI assistant, as long as it’s fully local.
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English5•1 month ago
Why would you want that in a browser? We have LLMs you can run local.
- jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 1•1 month ago
Can you let me have my own preferences? Am I allowed?
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English5•1 month ago
Not at the cost of my experience. It should be a optional feature if anything
- jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 1•1 month ago
Agreed. If you don’t want to use it it should just stay out of the way.
- prongs ( @prongs@lemm.ee ) 4•1 month ago
It’s an Inferred importance method, as other users have commented it is likely that there are some calibration metrics in there. MaxDiff is the name of the approach if you want to check out more.
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English1•1 month ago
Mozilla is weighting on the data. They found people love AI more than a slow browser.
- Dave ( @Dave@lemmy.nz ) 23•1 month ago
Everyone’s here complaining about the randomised questions when I’m just curious why location options are “Germany”, " Brazil", “USA”, or " Somewhere we don’t care about".
- ⸻ Ban DHMO 🇦🇺 ⸻ ( @unionagainstdhmo@aussie.zone ) English5•1 month ago
Yeah wtf going on there, what’s Germany, Brazil and USA got the rest of us don’t?
- jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 4•1 month ago
Those are simply the most significant Firefox user bases.
- The Cuuuuube ( @Cube6392@beehaw.org ) English3•1 month ago
Privacy law considerations. Germany is downright good for its citizens. The US has a round about spying industry. Brazil basically has mandatory mass surveilance. Everyone else’s laws are more or less the same. Not identical. But Mozilla can meet their requirements pretty trivially
- unwarlikeExtortion ( @unwarlikeExtortion@lemmy.ml ) 2•1 month ago
Everyone else’s laws are more or less the same.
The EU and UK have almost identical privacy laws - the GDPR, so Germany having exceptional privacy laws doesn’t hold up. As far as other privacy laws go I think France has a lead on Germany with approximately the same population, so privacy law can’t be the main consideration.
- The Cuuuuube ( @Cube6392@beehaw.org ) English1•1 month ago
Constituent states within the EU can have more laws on top of the EU’s laws. Maybe things have changed since the last time I had to implement code to respect these laws, but as of two years ago Germany and Sweden were the two countries where we had to make the most considerations with Germany being VERY strong
- anothermember ( @anothermember@lemmy.zip ) 20•1 month ago
This is one of the weirder surveys I’ve ever taken, I hope they know what they’re doing.
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English4•1 month ago
They have lot there minds just like the entire tech industry
- jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 19•1 month ago
You folks are really exaggerating. How is this survey weird? The random questions in groups of 3 make it easy to compare 3 features instead of rating 60 different features by most wanted to least wanted. In aggregate from thousands of replies, they can sort all answers.
- kill_dash_nine ( @kill_dash_nine@lemm.ee ) English6•1 month ago
I feel like most of these people were way over analyzing the questions. No reason to look for in depth meaning of possible answers, just answer them and take them at face value.
- pop ( @pop@lemmy.ml ) 19•1 month ago
Do they publish any of the data from these surveys or use it as an excuse to remove more useful features?
“We listen to our community, so now we’re removing
about: config
access from stable desktop builds to match the mobile version to provide uniform builds, making problems easier to replicate and also provide better security for all. Please use beta or nightly builds for tinkering.”- jet ( @jet@hackertalks.com ) English12•1 month ago
Product managers know what KPI’s they want to improve, and its almost never survey sentiment results. The survey will be used to justify projects that improve the KPIs they already have. Best case scenario it helps them choose what to work on first, worst case (and most likely) it doesn’t matter what the survey says - it’s engineered to justify a pet project.
i.e. Straight out of “how to lie with statistics” - Would you rather drink bleach or add in browser advertisements based on privacy respecting AI categorization of you browsing behavior? … The people have spoken and they OVERWHELMINGLY want more monetization in their browser.
- NauticalNoodle ( @NauticalNoodle@lemmy.ml ) 2•1 month ago
Duh. I’d rather drink bleach.
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English2•1 month ago
Honestly it the world gets bad enough it could get that extreme…
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English7•1 month ago
“We found that users wanted AI over a 2x slower browser”
- nilclass ( @nilclass@discuss.tchncs.de ) 1•1 month ago
Damn, i was hoping for them to make it slower!
- Hugh_Jeggs ( @Hugh_Jeggs@lemm.ee ) 19•1 month ago
I wonder what percentage of people chose “Least important” for “Do you want another fucking annoying pointless AI assistant?”
- fmstrat ( @fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com ) English16•1 month ago
Bring back PWA!!
Sadly, they’re probably thinking mobile.
- Eufalconimorph ( @Eufalconimorph@discuss.tchncs.de ) 4•1 month ago
PWAs were a feature I marked “want least”. I don’t like a cluttered home screen, I’d much rather just use bookmarks.
- fmstrat ( @fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com ) English2•1 month ago
The reason I mention PWA for desktop is very different from mobile, but for either, a PWA can live anywhere, it’s just a menu less browser with the site’s icon vs the firefox one. Handy for sites with no apps that you want to be able to task switch independently for. They dont have to be on a home screen or desktop.
Granted, the wording of the question would make one think so.
- Eufalconimorph ( @Eufalconimorph@discuss.tchncs.de ) 1•1 month ago
Yes, it’s a fancy way to save a tab. I just leave the tab open. Not a feature I want, so not something I want them to waste limited development time on. It’d be nice if it were through the bookmarks interface, so booarks could save state & history the way tabs do, but that’s not what’s proposed so I’d rather not have this. PWAs are a workaround to make up for the limitations of bookmarks.
- jbk ( @jbk@discuss.tchncs.de ) 2•1 month ago
Don’t PWAs already exist and work on mobile? I think they’d work on desktop PWAs again then
- fmstrat ( @fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com ) English1•1 month ago
Nope, just shortcuts.
- give ( @give@phuu.uk ) 15•1 month ago
@neme loaded questions are loaded.
The “Want most” to “Want least” scale is loaded AF.
Where is the option for “I don’t want any of these things”?
Edit: Yeah, fuck that. That survey is bullshit. I stopped bothering to give answers due to the multi-choice questions seeming like a way for Mozilla to have a wank about itself.
- Vincent ( @Vincent@feddit.nl ) 22•1 month ago
This is fairly standard survey design, I believe. They’re not looking to know which features are wanted in general; they want to know their relative popularity. The sets you’re presented are randomised (i.e. we don’t all get to see the same sets), which allows them to get a ranked list of lots of potential features, while only having to run ten survey questions per participant.
If you get a set with three features that everyone likes or dislikes at about the same level, then it doesn’t really matter want you answer: they’ll all end up at the top or bottom of the list, respectively. Because each of those options also get presented as part of different sets to different users, where different answers can win out.
- prongs ( @prongs@lemm.ee ) 9•1 month ago
You’re bang on. It’s called MaxDiff. I use it frequently in my line of work to prioritise product or service messaging with panel data. It’s better in some cases to use Inferred preference rather than stated, but generally good to keep the options comparable in “size” of offer.
I would never interpret a MaxDiff model low end result as “wow, 5% of people want slower browsers.” Instead I’m focusing on the top cluster. As with any model, they’re only ever so accurate. Don’t read into the questions too much.
- thingsiplay ( @thingsiplay@beehaw.org ) 8•1 month ago
The problem with this design is, if people do not care, then they will give random answers, if they don’t have the option to not care. Also this would be important information for Mozilla too, if many people do not care about a specific question. So I feel like they should have done that. But, who am I…
- Vincent ( @Vincent@feddit.nl ) 2•1 month ago
Presumably if people don’t care, they don’t fill in the survey. But as an extra failsafe, they’ve also included the feature “twice as slow as your current browser”. If you rank that high, then your result can probably be discarded.
But yeah, this design has worked well for many other surveys, so presumably it’ll work well for this one. They’re the experts :)
- thingsiplay ( @thingsiplay@beehaw.org ) 3•1 month ago
Presumably if people don’t care, they don’t fill in the survey.
That’s not what I said. People care about the survey and they do a favor to Mozilla with it. And if a question does not have the answer they want to give, then it becomes a problem. It’s a different scenario than what you were saying.
But yeah, this design has worked well for many other surveys, so presumably it’ll work well for this one. They’re the experts :)
With that attitude and without acknowledging a problem, it won’t get better. If they were the experts, then they wouldn’t need a survey. But its easy to discredit any credit with that dumb argument.
- Vincent ( @Vincent@feddit.nl ) 1•1 month ago
They’re the experts in survey-taking, not in knowing what the users want - the users are experts in that. Hence the survey.
That remark was basically a reformulation of and agreeing with your “But, who am I…”
- SkyeStarfall ( @SkyeStarfall@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 2•1 month ago
Any uncertainty would be filtered out by the scale of people answering
- give ( @give@phuu.uk ) 4•1 month ago
@Vincent couldn’t finish the survey purely because of the questions suggesting that I should “want” something.
Perhaps if they asked the question differently, they’d have gotten a completed survey from me.
I can’t answer loaded questions.
The samples they get are meaningless if only people who complete the survey are counted.
The fact that I couldn’t select none of them and move forward, meant something: Jerk Mozilla off, or don’t.
I chose not to, and I am a Mozilla user!
- blind3rdeye ( @blind3rdeye@lemm.ee ) 2•1 month ago
I’m half-way through the survey right now; and rather than continuing, just stalling because I don’t want to rank another set of three options that I don’t care about. Some of the choices already given were like “well, I guess I’ll pick the feature that I’ve at least thought about using once…” but now it’s just a list of 3 things that I don’t want whatsoever. I’m trying to give useful feedback, but I feel like I’m really just giving noise.
- give ( @give@phuu.uk ) 1•1 month ago
@blind3rdeye it’s a load of crap, isn’t it?
The statisticians may disagree, but they fail to understand that forcing “want” into the situation is not a true reflection of what people care about.
If they had just tweaked that one word, it wouldn’t be as much of a steaming pile of turds that it is.
It’s almost like they want people to not finish the survey, so they can have a warped sample.
- ReversalHatchery ( @ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org ) English2•1 month ago
I hope my response will get thrown out because I prefer a slower browser over built-in AI based personalization.
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English1•1 month ago
It doesn’t seem randomized based on what I have seen
- Vincent ( @Vincent@feddit.nl ) 1•1 month ago
You mean you’ve taken it multiple times and kept seeing the exact same ten sets?
- LWD ( @LWD@lemm.ee ) 5•1 month ago
I don’t know if the survey questions are loaded, but it feels like they could easily be misinterpreted.
For example, somebody might rank the “organize toolbar buttons and AI chatbots” even if they hate AI’s snake oil, and now Mozilla has a data point where they can say “Some of our respondents said they want AI as much as side tabs!”
This seems especially sketchy when the side tab idea came directly from a vocal portion of Mozilla users, while the decision to follow the AI chatbot trend was decided by the same management that overpays their CEO every year.
- kbal ( @kbal@fedia.io ) 13•1 month ago
All those features, and the only one I want is customizable hotkeys. Although I guess I’d also take “browser is twice as fast.”
- Thann ( @Thann@lemmy.ml ) English10•1 month ago
Which do you prefer:
( ) browser twice as fast
( ) women find you irresistible
- Blisterexe ( @Blisterexe@lemmy.zip ) 18•1 month ago
( x) browser twice as fast
( ) women find you irresistible
- jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 3•1 month ago
Faster browser any day…
- navordar ( @nawordar@lemmy.ml ) 13•1 month ago
Yes, I want the most for Firefox to be twice as slow as my current browser (Firefox/Fennec)
- heavyboots ( @heavyboots@lemmy.ml ) English12•1 month ago
I hope like hell the sets of questions were randomized, because if they weren’t, they were tweaked by the surveyors beforehand to try and force a particular result.
Like the AI question was paired with some incredibly crappy options like “A browser that runs 2x slower than your current browser”. Obviously they want you to click that option as least wanted and leave the AI development alone (if that wasn’t a randomized grouping).
Similarly, it looked like they were trying to decide which feature to sacrifice in support of AI dev in later questions, because all 3 would be things I enjoy much more than AI, but I have to rate one as least wanted.
EDIT: OK, thanks for all the responses everyone! Looks like my pairing of AI and 2x slower was just a bad random selection inducing extreme paranoia on my part. Very happy to hear that.
- LiveLM ( @LiveLM@lemmy.zip ) English10•1 month ago
They were randomized.
For me ‘2x slower’ was not paired with any AI. - jol ( @jol@discuss.tchncs.de ) 7•1 month ago
My 2x slower was paired with the 2x faster 🤣 guess which one I chose?
- communism ( @communism@lemmy.ml ) 4•1 month ago
It was randomised for me because the 2x slower option didn’t appear with any AI questions for me
- Possibly linux ( @possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip ) English3•1 month ago
This survey is very confusing
My conference in Mozilla is now almost zero
- zod000 ( @zod000@lemmy.ml ) 8•1 month ago
I took the survey and I didn’t like how they occasionally put all shitty features in a group and I had to pick one I wanted and then followed it with all good stuff in a group and I had to say I didn’t want one.