Australian Senate, last sitting of the year. No idea when the Social Media Ban debate is kicking off.
If anyone’s keen, feel free to give a live run-down of anything interesting in this thread.
(sorry about all the edits, just trying to get a decent thumbnail: 
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We should ban u16s from public transport. Too many have had fatal accidents due to dangerous behaviour around railways and bus stops. Compulsory learning from home, now!
If you think that’s a solid argument or one based in logic, good news. You’d probably make for an ideal liberal senator.
Satire, I thought it was obvious.
Welp went over my head, my bad, imma blame it on Poe’s law or somethingsatirical but critical of the bill my point stands.Yes, @oahi@aussie.zone was being critical of the Bill. Because it’s about as well thought-out as their satirical banning of children on public transport.
I see a lot of people parroting surface level points provided by those in opposition to the bill but little addressing it. Especially the “social credit” nonsense. As mentioned in the debate digital ID wouldn’t be the only means for these social media companies to verify users. Though I agree that how it’s been rushed through is inappropriate.
Well, I generally don’t consider satire to be a solid argument, it usuallp consisting of a joke and all. But if it makes people think, I’d consider it a win.
This bill is clearly not an effective solution for the stated problem. If you think it is, you’d probably make a good liberal senator.
All good
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Call of duty lobbies mentioned in senate. What a time to be alive lmao
Yes, and rightly so. Because this bill is so immensely stupid and the process by which it has been enacted so deeply undemocratic, that even a moron like Canavan (or was it Antic?) can see that the way they’ve carved out exemptions is haphazard and poorly thought through.
“Comrade! Papers! NOW!”
I remember when we used to be horrified at some of the terrible regimes and their draconian requirements and powers.
And yet, here we are happily strolling into the same situation.
I don’t see how the communist remark is relevant. Social media has proliferated largely unchecked. They are potentially damaging platforms, especially for younger people. That’s ignoring the rampant misinformation. I mean have a look at X and the “your body my choice” nonsense. I’m surprised people are genuinely advocating for the multimillion dollar corporations being in charge rather than our government.
We’re in danger of a domino effect happening across the planet where governments finally have the de facto authorization to scour youth and youth culture off the web. For millions this is the loss of a right to access they had assumed from birth. Any argument that applies to children browsing the web applies to adults, since we recurringly prove we’re not better decision makers than children.
In my country the elite are pedophiles who want to marry children and allow them to be employed debt trapping them and then forcing them into a financial corner. Our highest lawman was nearly an actual known child sex trafficker but his appointment would have sparked a World War III like series of disclosures and open blackmailing because there are now too many pedophiles running the government to effecticely threaten each other.
There is a type of common sexual deviancy inspired by eastern cartoons that fetishizes the undeveloped body. It is commonly defended by its connosieurs as valid art from a superior enlightened culture. There is a throughline of normalization of child marriage and relationship forming that is slowly being legitimized and trust me it was already legal in half my country to marry children, but not acceptable.
Meanwhile childrens identities are making them targets in school hallways, bathrooms, and gymnasiums. The ramifications of the social world order bear down on them without their consent or understanding. Fascism splits up children into tribal groups and targettable minorities just the same as adults.
Darkest of all is the future promise of more children disappearing into a black hole. Closed borders where only ICE and men like Matt Gaetz and the late great Epstein have the power to move through unabbated. In Trump’s first administration they told us to our faces they lost 1,488 children. 1,488 necessary victims of border policy. They lost more than that, 1,488 if you don’t know, is a Nazi dogwhistle referring to the 14 words and then signalling allegience to Adolph Hitler. They told us to our face they threw fifteen hundred children down a well. Where are they now?
Who benefits ultimately from controlling what children see and think? Who benefits from being able to silence them? Who benefits from being able speak for children?
Children’s rights and liberties are a flashpoint in our civilizations understanding, worship, and secret contempt for the concept of natural and civil rights. When they’re shoved off the net another much more easily targettable adult minority will be next.
Question; Would you rather incompetent public servants retaining one set of your personal data or multiple commercial interests collecting your personal data?
Except in the case of a data breach, your information is much more secure with The Government as long as they are kept accountable.
Unfortunately the Shit Party and the Shit Lite Party appear to be doing everything they can to prove that government is not accountable, (except for their “Lobbyists”).
Is lemmy exempt I wonder?
They prolly don’t know it exists. If they do, be prepared to switch instance as I doubt lodion will want to deal with Id checking
I, and at least one other person here sent submissions in specifically mentioning the fediverse.
Mine wasn’t a very technical submission, i tried to focus on the value and potential destruction of that value if safeguards aren’t allowed for nascent social media.
So at least there is a record of it. My worry is all the Muskivites submissions will drown out ones like mine.
It’s not even clear yet what form the ID checking will take. They’ve rushed this through way too fast and without proper consultation. But there does seem to be some sort of a plan that the ID checking would be done by a government service in some manner, rather than users needing to send ID directly to the platform.
Govt service is still bad, still links everyones social media accounts to their ID. The bill will do jackshit anyways, as under 16s will simply move to social media hosted outside of Australia.
So of the top ofnyour head, a VPN will allow you to skirt this law?
I don’t use social media beyond lemmy but be fucked if I want to give my I.D to anyone in relation to my online activities
Well, a VPN fakes your country, and the law only applies in Australia. Also, it is an unenforceable law anyways so I doubt it would do much
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Last I saw the suggestions were drivers license or equivalent, face scan, or digital id. They’ve probably walked that back though or will do so because hell nah
Govt service, or privatised ID assurance face-scanning service wrought with error?
Like I said, it’s not clear yet what form it will take.
I’ll take that as a no
The info is still really vague but seemed to so far apply to big platforms like reddit and facebook and X - however my info might be outdated by now.
Then again it could be that the fines for non compliance and verification charges might also apply to smaller platforms with less available funding than the big companies, and push them under.
The info I’ve been reading seems to be inconsistent and sometimes even conflict. And yeah, could be outdated by now
The relevant Minister will be able to give exemptions as needed, but unfortunately there is no threshold for any sort of minimum size requirement or for non-profit community groups. So we would probably, to be completely lawful, need to get chummy with some politicians who can reach out to the Minister and seek an exemption.
(But realistically, we’re probably small enough that nobody would notice.)
Too many kids die over this shit. The corpos have had, what, 15 years (?) to sort this shit out.
So now we see the heavy handed government regulation coming along. That’s what happens.
So now we all have to hand over ID to the government which will link our real identities to our online activity?
And that’s a good idea you think?
Are you sure you can’t imagine a scenario where that might be an issue?
Actually, don’t worry. Government databases never get hacked, and politicians never deceive the populace for nefarious purposes.
🙄
What about “heavy handed” makes you think I thought this was a good idea?
Why does Labor always do this? Instead of concentrating on good social policy and undoing some of the pro-corporation crap the Liberals have snuck in, they come up with some utter stupidity about the internet and end up dying on that hill.
Internet filter repeat incoming. This will be their undoing next election.
I have warned about this. Access to online services will soon be locked behind your mygov id.
These plans have been in motion for a long time.
Games are explicitly excluded from this law.
Which is kinda fucking ridiculous, as pointed out in debate, because in-game chat is often some of the most toxic you’ll encounter.
tbh I’m more concerned about kids on cod or battle.net than insta chat (research has found a lot of kids using Instagram for absurd numbers of hours are actually just chatting).
In Labor’s defense (as loath as I am to defend them for this), many parents seem to be concerned less with the content of the messages than with the amount of time their children are spending obsessing over it. Which is much harder for them to control on a phone app than in-game console chat.
Still a parenting issue IMO and not a matter for the legislature.
It’s a moral panic. When I was a kid sitting close to the TV would make you blind.
I hate this dodgy piece of legislation. I want socmed regulated to hell, like no non-curated recommendations that aren’t transparent filters like ‘new’ or ‘top votes’, full responsibility as a publisher for the content of messages etc. I just don’t see how a slapshod reactionary ban is going to do much useful for society broadly.
I feel like the platforms will remain just as addictive and cruel, kids will just start using them later, kids will get around bans to use unregulated shithole sites, and people will wash their hands of understanding the actually nuanced problem of kids and screen time.
Meanwhile the police state expands. Cool and good.
full responsibility as a publisher for the content of messages
We really don’t want this. America’s Section 230 is a really good legal framework, and it’s very important. Because if you didn’t have that sort of protection, it would become almost impossible for smaller competitors to enter the market. The likes of Facebook and Twitter should be made more liable than they are for misinformation that survives even after being reported—and for continuing to host individuals who have repeatedly been seen sharing disinformation. But as a default assumption, platforms should not be liable for content users shared. Unless your goal is to kill off all platforms that aren’t already big enough to easily comply.
Why do you want more social media companies? Ideally the industry is regulated out of existence, at least in its current form.
What social good is served should not be in the hands of companies mining data and advertising. Forums, self hosted federated systems, and chat rooms were/are all vastly superior in terms of social good:harm ratio.
Making it completely unprofitable and impossible to comply with under current mass signup sell ads models would be the point.
34 yes 19 no
Faaark, I’m agreeing with Malcolm Roberts!
Debate’s kicked off.
