I needed another corded mouse and this time around I thought of @PKL@mastodon.social and @pronk@mastodon.social instead of Logitech’s shareholders. These guys make open source mice among other open source hardware under the brand Ploopy. You can order one from them, assembled or as a kit, or you could print and build it entirely by yourself.
The mouse itself is pretty great. Coming from a long line of Logitech (MX518/G5/G500/G502), it’s a bit larger than what I’m used to but I think I’m getting accustomed to it.
Here’s another shot of it:
I bought a Ploopy Thumb a few years ago. I assembled it myself, and was pleasantly surprised at how easy it was (when actually following the instructions).
The small button on the right has broken twice, which wasn’t a problem because I just downloaded the stl file and reprinted the button assembly.
I wanted horizontal scrolling, so I used QMK to make the trackball a scroll wheel when the right side button is pressed (that may explain the faster button wear). It was surprisingly easy, and there was even a comment in the source code pointing out which line I should modify for horizontal scrolling support. I guess they expected people to want this feature.
The price is high, but I don’t expect to buy another mouse unless my needs change. The open source hardware and software is excellent, making repairability 10/10. The edges of the buttons are slightly rough, but I have the 3d printing files, so I get to choose what material it’s made of and what post processing / smoothing is used. It hasn’t bothered me enough to do anything about it.
While I can’t recommend a trackball mouse to anyone, I can recommend Ploopy. It’s one of the few products that I feel like I actually own.
How do you use a trackball mouse? Does moving the mouse and moving the trackball both move the pointer? Or one moves the pointer and the other does something else?
The mouse stays in one location with grippy feet and the trackball moves the cursor. There is no sensor for mouse movement. It does take a while to get used to.
The reason I chose it was that I didn’t have enough desk space to move a mouse. I barely even had enough space to put the mouse. Now that I’ve moved house, I just like the novelty. It’s not as accurate as a regular mouse.
I would love a mouse that could do both regular movement and trackball movement so I could have 4 axis inputs. Sadly, I haven’t found any like that.
I helped a user who exclusively uses a trackball and started getting used to it within seconds. My thumb was definitely not used to the trackball but I very quickly adapted and could navigate the computer normally
How’d you make the surface this smooth?
Overuse and poor lighting.
I know some people have used an acetone vapor bath with ABS prints. I’ve never looked into what works with PLA.
LOL, makes sense. I’m considering using epoxy. Seems like there’s a product that can be brushed on. It fills the gaps. Can be painted if desired.
I’d be interested to see how well it works.
I’ll try to remember to post if I end up doing it.
What I really want is this, but with a trackpad instead of a trackball.
They do have a trackpad, but not in this shape.
I was surprised when I started using the Steamdeck. The Steamdeck’s trackpad felt almost identical to my trackball mouse, and it took effectively no time to get used to it.
The advantage of a trackball over a trackpad is that you can spin the ball for high movement speed, then stop it after a set time for fairly accurate distance. A trackball (or trackpad) will never be as accurate as a regular moue, but it is surprisingly usable (after a few months or practice).
I’ve used several trackballs, but they have all been seriously uncomfortable for me and my specific brand of RSI. My current “mouse” is a Steam Controller, but using it one-handed isn’t great due to the uneven weight distribution. I also have much better accuracy using a trackpad vs a trackball.
Ideally, I just want a Steam Controller cut in half with a more confortable grip that doesn’t dig into my palm.
Is it comfortable in the hand? The surface looks super rough
All Ploopy’s stuff looks rough. I think they’re 3D-printing them. Maybe one day they’ll progress to something that gives a nicer result.
I was looking at their trackballs but the ambidextrous ones look awkwardly tiny and have rattly bearings, in addition to the rough finish. I support what they’re doing but I wish the products were a bit less prototypey.
It looks rough, but it’s actually fairly comfortable.The only bit that bothered me was the edge of one of the buttons, and a nail file fixed that in seconds.
Yeah, definitely 3D printed.
I think they’re 3D-printing them. Maybe one day they’ll progress to something that gives a nicer result
Yes they are 3D printed
Poorly 3D printed.
The layering issue could be solved by orienting the object at a 45° angle
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I could reprint the housing one day, when I get a printer myself. 😂
The whole point is that it’s open source and they want people to be able to print them themselves.
Theoretically, you can mold it to fit your hand but the tolerances and mountings make that a hassle.
As for the print itself? Most people just do a quick print and have the telltale ridges from layers. But you can futz with settings to improve the smoothness or just finish the print itself. At which point it is not going to be as smooth as injection molding but it will be more “different” than “bad”.
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It depends how it was printed.
As a SUPER simplified basic: Any 3d print consists of walls/perimeters and infill. The walls are the exterior surfaces of the print. The infill is what is inside. And the vast majority of prints tend to be sparse infills. So rather than solid plastic beneath those walls, you mostly just have air and a mesh structure of some form.
So if the wall is thick enough (generally referred to as “number of walls”)? Sure. If it isn’t? You’ll just see the void inside the shell itself and make things much worse.
What is generally done to reduce “3d printed texture” is a mixture of smaller print layers (so the ridges are much thinner), printing with more walls, and actually lightly melting the exterior surface (either through chemicals or heat).
VKB are probably the kings of the mid-range sicko HOTAS market and I am like 90% certain they 3d print the shell of their sticks for the Gladiator (?). But they do such a good job that I genuinely can’t be certain. Whereas the vast majority of ploopy builds… aren’t that.
It feels good. I’m thinking of smoothing it with epoxy but it’s not necessary.
Only as good as your 3d printer and settings I’d say
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Now do printers.
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I have written a more detailed comment on it before, but 2d printing is much more technically complicated than 3D printing, and the resolution is literally an order of magnitude difference (0.2mm vs <42um) and the printer has to print full color on any surface with microdots in a very very short time. People would throw the printer out if it took 10 minutes for a single paper like a large first layer takes in 3D printing.
We were ok with dot matrix printers. We are and will be ok with black and white prints. Open Source community will be ok with a slow and ugly print. The company just need to allow their monopoly to be broken. I don’t think they will.
Super cool and I totally see the appeal, but at nearly 3x the price of my Logitech g502 for a 3d printed mouse with a technically inferior sensor, it’s a big ask.
Layer lines, too expensive.
Looks less comfortable than one of those 10~15€ brandless mouses at MediaMarkt
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Layer lines
You say “free hand grip for less strain” weird.
I keep thinking I should give a ploopy a shot but I’ve increasingly grown to like/need vertical mice and, like most ploopy related efforts, it is mostly “you CAN do it” with nobody ever having even tried because it requires pretty hefty redesigns of almost every part to mount things correctly.
I’m waiting for my MX to die to get one! I really like the idea of open hardware and this looks like a good mouse.
This is pretty cool. I make and 3d print pieces for my G502 to make it fit better for my hand/nubs. This seems like it has a lot of potential to design something better for me. That price is steep though but being disabled that’s nothing new to me.
You need plastic that is more resistant to contact so that you don’t end up covering your hand in microplastics. That material looks like questionable recycled plastics.
I’m also not giving up on wireless. I’d rather have an only bluetooth (slow?) mouse than a wired one.
All the 3d printed parts have files available online. You can 3d print new parts using any material you want.
As far as I’m aware, PLA is mostly safe, but every company has different proprietary additives.
Something plant based like cellulose would be nice. Longevity wouldn’t be a concern with how easy it is to reprint and reassemble.
Wireless would be nice.
Or titanium? But that would probably require midifications of the bendy bits to keep them flexible. 😂
I kinda like the idea of using an anvil to smith a computer mouse, but I don’t have such tools. Perhaps carving the shapes from wood would be easier.
I do agree with you. Except for the Bluetooth. Those mouses always need batteries and are empty and the mouse too heavy.
I want an open source mouse with electromagnetic resistance wheel like one in Logitech MX Master 3S.
Might not be too difficult to achieve by connecting a small electric motor to the scroll wheel axle. Then you could vary the resistance by changing a pot hooked the motor’s terminals.
I am also a big fan of the MX518 lineage mice, so I hope someone make a version that has that shape. When Logitech released an updated MX518 several years back I bought a couple of them, so I will be good for years hopefully.
How do you like the mouse? I got their trackpad and it’s pretty good. I’m thinking about replacing my old Mx Master with their mouse.
I like it. The surface finish is obviously not as nice as the Logitech, but I like it. I’d probably like it better if it were smooth, which I might try achieving with some epoxy paint. The button feel is great. Better than my G502. Tracking is stellar. The shape is comfortable. The infinite/togglable scroll wheel on the G502 is sonething I wish it had but I can live without it. There’s also that special feeling, that someone decent made it, and that it can be infinitely repaired. If it’s not a stretch money-wise for you - get one. In the worst case scebario your money would have gone supporting open source hardware.
Ah great! My hands are big and all the mouses I tried are all too small. And it’s giving me rsi. Hopefully this will help me. I theory I can just potentially print my own mouse design that finally fit my hands?
The PCB has electrical buttons permanently attached. The 3D printed parts have protrusions that touch the buttons.
You could possibly redesign the 3D printed parts only, but at some size increase you may need to start looking into redesigning the PCB.The good news is that the mouse itself is bigger than the picture makes it seem. You might actually be OK without modifications.
If you do want to give it a try, I highly recommend buying the kit and fully assembling it yourself. That way you know that it works, and you have a solid foundation to apply the modifications to.
Good point. It measures at about 13x8.5cm.
You probably can modify the existing one to fit your hand fairly easily.
I want one
