alt text

A 4 panel comic. In the first panel, a character stands on a cliff, addressing an audience, and says “trans kids should not get puberty blockers”. In the second panel, the audience, armed and labeled “cis people”, looks content. In the third panel, the character on the cliff says “they should get hrt so they can go through the right puberty at the same time as their cis peers”. In the fourth panel, the audience, still labeled “cis people”, looks angry at the character.

if you’re cis and seeing this: keep your concern trolling to yourself.

  • riwo ( riwo@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 
    8·
    1 day ago

    many effects are quite hard to reverse

    • breasts: don’t magically disappear on t. needs surgery
    • deep voice: doesn’t magically get much higer through e. needs voice training
    • bones: barely change afaik except for pelvic tilt on e if you start it early enough. including growing/shrinking and facial bone structure. needs surgery
    • body hair: gets thinner and sometimes less on e but chest and facial hair stay. needs lazer hair removal or electrolizis
    • balding: only minimally reverses on e. needs hair transplants

    what second puberty can achieve:

    • t:
      • deepening voice
      • new and thicker body hair including facial hair
      • fat and muscles redistribution in masculine conotated way
      • balding
      • increasing clitoris size
      • increase skin more oily
    • e:
      • breast growth
      • redistributing fat and muscles in feminie conotated way
      • thinning body and facial hair
      • stopping some balding and slightly reversing it
      • slight shrinking
      • pelvic tilting
      • make skin softer and less oily

    i might have missed some things and of course everyones mileage may varie.

    some aspects of first puberty can’t be reversed using hrt and they often are both used to invalidate trans people and can cause a lot of dysphoria. it’s why many trans people who get to medically transition are still quite unhappy.

    • gegil ( gegil@sopuli.xyz ) 
      1·
      1 day ago

      As you said, those changes are hard to reverse, but they are reversible. And while bone structure does not change, and even after finfing out about it, i still dont understand in what way bone structure matters for trans people?

      • riwo ( riwo@lemmy.blahaj.zone ) 
        6·
        1 day ago

        you are shifting the goal post now.

        much of this reversing does not come from hrt as u initially claimed but from hard work and expensive as well as sometimes life threatening surgeries. it should absolutely be avoided if possible.

        bones do not have to be a big deal if one is as lucky to get androgynous bones out of first puberty, or has a very excepting environment which does not care about these things and one does themselves not care much about them either. but in many cases trans people are as unlucky to end up with bones making them noticably larger/broader or shorter than the norm for their gender or with pronounced facial bones which despite fat redistribution and makeup cause them to be read as a gender that they are not. this can be extremely dysphoria inducing and make them more likely targets for harassment.

        the way to change this (if there even is one) is through painful, dangerous, and very expensive surgeries. full facial feminization surgery for example will cost as much as 50k and is often not covered by insurance as well as often requiring people to travel to travel to foreign countries. this is not an option for many people. even if health insurance covered this, it would still be a giant pain and come with risks. there is no reason to not let people chose for themselves and avoid this situation in more cases.

        • gegil ( gegil@sopuli.xyz ) 
          1·
          1 day ago

          Thanks for explanation. I did a real mistake in incorrectly wording my question about changes reversible with hrt, instead of asking what changes must be done with difficult and expensive surgeries. Also, i did end up enough androgynous after puberty to get biased towards not thinking that it might have much more severe effects for other transgender people.