I didn’t want to direct this question to Americans specifically because, at this point, other countries have shown support to Israel in one or the other way. If my country was financing this, I would be taking the streets. Shit, I’m right now in the hospital but all I can think about is protesting anyway just to feel I did something to stop this madness.
Are you doing something about this? Are you feeling unsettled? How do you feel about all this mess?
EDIT: So, buying Chinese stuff takes the USS Gerald Ford to Gaza’s coast. Also, TIL that that chocolate my cousin gave me when she was 20 and I was 5, (delicious stuff!) made me a slavist-ish. The fact remains, this genocide is being paid and supported by taxpayers money; of course, I was hoping that most of us didn’t pay taxes wishing for this. Thank you all for your responses, some of them were hard to swallow.
- jmcs ( @jmcs@discuss.tchncs.de ) 39•1 year ago
Since you probably buy stuff made in China like everyone else, you tell us.
- ComradeKhoumrag ( @ComradeKhoumrag@infosec.pub ) 8•1 year ago
China meets the manufacturing needs for most of the world, it’s economically not realistic to boycott them
That said, we still should boycott them, at least in principle.
- jmcs ( @jmcs@discuss.tchncs.de ) 1•1 year ago
In general I agree with you, but reality is also more nuanced. A blanket boycott can often harm the people you want to protect. A common question in the debate about Palestine and Uyghurstan and boycotts is what to do about companies that give equal opportunities to people from the targeted communities - i.e. companies that give jobs in the same terms to both Israelis and Palestinians or the Han Chinese and Uyghur people.
If you read the thread, or at least my responses, you would probably made a more conscious effort to answer my question.
- Aatube ( @Aatube@kbin.social ) 36•1 year ago
Leading question.
Edit: For an actual “answer”, some people are in fact taking it to the streets. For your favorite country you can search for it and if you don’t want to do that here’s an article for the US. While you may argue that we should’ve expected this, at the time of financing all we know is that there was a first strike and people were angry. Now it’s different, at least in my local circle.
Either way, this should not be a question for asklemmy. It should be in the politics community or something.
- MxM111 ( @MxM111@kbin.social ) 13•1 year ago
Loaded question.
- state_electrician ( @state_electrician@discuss.tchncs.de ) English31•1 year ago
I feel that taking one side over the other without allowing for any nuance in that complicated clusterfuck over there is disingenuous. I feel very sorry for all civilians caught between the many murderous assholes in that region, but I can’t fully support one group while completely condemning the other. Acting like it’s a black and white issue is so very wrong and not helpful.
- neptune ( @neptune@dmv.social ) English9•1 year ago
But our government did pick a side. So what is our obligation, then?
Let your delegate know that you wish for more nuance, that instead of supporting the state of Israel, that it’d be better to side with the civilians on all sides who are dying in this messed up conflict.
- Space Sloth ( @stagen@feddit.dk ) 4•1 year ago
Well put and i completely agree!
- Browning ( @Browning@lemmings.world ) 28•1 year ago
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
Keep posting of that’s all you can do right now.- jimmydoreisalefty ( @jimmydoreisalefty@lemmus.org ) English9•1 year ago
Great quote you made me think of.
The truth hurts, but silence kills. -Mark Twain
- InfiniteGlitch ( @ModernRisk@lemmy.dbzer0.com ) 16•1 year ago
DISGUSTING.
Prime minister of my country supports Israel because “they’re allowed to defend themselves”.
What is happening now, has nothing to do with defending themselves, it’s their mission to genocide. I cannot believe the entire world is fine with it. Western but also Arabian countries unfortunately.
In my opinion, “justice” does not exist. It never did. Because it seems the law doesn’t apply to Presidents and a country that purely stands for genocide.
- java ( @java@beehaw.org ) 16•1 year ago
Sometimes I feel like people forget that Israel was actually attacked.
- serratur ( @serratur@lemmy.wtf ) 23•1 year ago
Still doesn’t justify commiting a genocide
- marxistsynths19 ( @marxistsynths19@lemmy.ml ) 14•1 year ago
Israel has been attacking Gaza and destroying Palestinian lives for the last 75 years. How is resistance not justified? Zionist idiot.
- FluffyPotato ( @FluffyPotato@lemm.ee ) 13•1 year ago
My country has been voting to condemn Israel’s treatment of Palestine in the UN until 2022 but they will probably vote the same now. As far as I know my country doesn’t support Israel monetarily either so I’m pretty happy.
- shiveyarbles ( @shiveyarbles@beehaw.org ) 2•1 year ago
This is the way
- masquenox ( @masquenox@lemmy.ml ) 11•1 year ago
It’s never just been the US - Israel doesn’t just have a whole bunch of enablers… said enablers also back the very idea of a modern-day Israel.
France, the UK, Germany, Australia, Apartheid-era South Africa all played their part in helping with all this - I guess the fact that it’s all countries with histories that are deeply entwined with white supremacism, antisemitism and colonialism is purely coincidence, eh?
- ChaddingtonDuck ( @ChaddingtonDuck@beehaw.org ) 3•1 year ago
Did I read this correctly? You just tried to say that Israel’s supporters are antisemitic? How’d you connect those two dots?
- masquenox ( @masquenox@lemmy.ml ) 6•1 year ago
You just tried to say that Israel’s supporters are antisemitic?
No. I never tried to say it.
I just plain said it - the countries that enable Israel is as antisemitic and white supremacist as they have always been. They’ve been hiding it since WW2 - but, as the resurgence of mask-off far-right ideology in the US and Europe proves, it’s still the same old west.
The west’s support for Israel has always been antisemitic - dumping European Jewish people in Palestine was literally one the Nazi’s potential solutions to the “Jewish Question”. It’s no secret - just mundane history that westerners doesn’t like talking about.
Christian Zionism predates Jewish Zionism - the whole reason these white supremacist and antisemitic societies fantasized about a modern-day “Israel” was simply because they did not believe Jewish people belonged in their precious “white” societies.
You don’t have to think about it for very long to see it for yourself - who were the people that made it so difficult for Jewish people to “belong” in western societies? If the US was so friendly and welcoming to Jewish people as the US wants to pretend it is (prominent Jewish people like Steven Spielberg and Noam Chomsky will happily tell you about US-style antisemitism), why would Jewish people need a “homeland” in the middle-east?
- magnetosphere ( @HappyMeatbag@beehaw.org ) English7•1 year ago
No. I never tried to say it. I just plain said it…
I’d like to point out to folks that whatever your stance on the issue may be, this statement (taken by itself) is pretty funny.
Please excuse the interruption and continue.
- SkepticElliptic ( @SkepticElliptic@beehaw.org ) 11•1 year ago
It’s giving me Iraq war vibes, except my friends aren’t getting involved. The escalation doesn’t make sense at all unless you consider Netanyahu needed to distract from his aspirations of becoming a dictator.
- demystify ( @demystify@lemmy.ml ) English10•1 year ago
The only thing I’m dissatisfied with is their free hand with bombing civilians along with military targets. I can understand that Israel is angry, and rightfully so, but they fancy themselves a western country, being better than terrorist Hamas. They can’t let their anger take control. Bombing civilians undermines their legitimatecy, I think they should try and be as surgical as possible, like they did in previous rounds of fighting. Other than that, I fully support their desire to root out Hamas. Though conquering Gaza only has any merit to it if they decide to stay and govern it themselves, otherwise Hamas would just rise up again.
Are you satisfied about they having a nuclear arsenal after this? It’s not a rhetorical question, I’m actually interested in your thoughts about this.
- demystify ( @demystify@lemmy.ml ) English4•1 year ago
I don’t know, what does it matter? They don’t even acknowledge it, nevermind about using it. The only instance in which they might use their nukes is the Samson Option, which looks like something any country would do.
It matters because it changes all logics in a war. In this case, I think it matters because you described them as angry, bombing civilians along with military targets. If they don’t differentiate one of the other, the only thing stopping them from nuking the Gaza stripe is probably the inconvenience of being too close.
- demystify ( @demystify@lemmy.ml ) English5•1 year ago
Ah, I see. No, they’re not that stupid. Even if nuking Gaza didn’t affect them because of proximity, they wouldn’t. They rely on American help too much, and struggle as they do with international forces. Nuking Gaza would leave them ostricized and heavily sanctioned, if not invaded.
- intensely_human ( @intensely_human@lemm.ee ) 1•1 year ago
Or nuked
- jimmydoreisalefty ( @jimmydoreisalefty@lemmus.org ) English3•1 year ago
Looking at the geopolitics and many sides of the conflict, wouldn’t other better and bigger groups join in if it comes close to the annihilation of Hamas?
Looking at Hezbollah and Iran, joining in as a minimum.
This would start making the war closer to WWIII.
Anyone with more information or confidence want to correct or add detail?
- masquenox ( @masquenox@lemmy.ml ) 3•1 year ago
This attack will energize the populations of a lot of middle-eastern regimes that have been playing footsie with Israel over the last few decades - so yeah… both in the long and short term things are looking shaky for Israel. Would it lead to WW3? Unlikely… even if Israel’s geopolitical reach and importance is curbed by this, the US already has another thug regime in the area that can do it’s dirty work for it - Saudi Arabia.
- Omega_Haxors ( @Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml ) 10•1 year ago
I want to finance a complete genocide of mosquitos and i’m not kidding.
- magnetosphere ( @HappyMeatbag@beehaw.org ) English9•1 year ago
I don’t like it one bit.
The government sees it as a strategic need to have a strong ally in the region. That view will not change, at least not anytime soon. The Pentagon considers it a national security issue, which puts it beyond politics. Unfortunately, I have to live with that.
- intensely_human ( @intensely_human@lemm.ee ) 2•1 year ago
It’s also worth noting that people serving high positions in the military are in their offices far longer than our elected officials.
- PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S [he/him] ( @PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S@lemmy.sdf.org ) English8•1 year ago
If my country was financing this, I would be taking the streets.
If I took to the streets over this, I would make protestors look bad because I have no experience, no social skills, no support network, and I’m a terrible rhetorician, especially when I am angry. Additionally, my family is fast to call the cops and has promised me that they would cooperate with the police if I ever got on their radar, so my presence would be a security culture issue.
Are you doing something about this?
Well, I have chosen not to work for companies that participate in such genocides, which is not a completely vacuous statement because they have sent me recruitment emails to design their fucking missiles! But frankly, I am fighting my own battles right now. I am desperately trying to find work. I am constantly fighting insurers to pay for the few times I ever muster up the courage to use my insurance. I am fighting my own goddamn family who will throw me to the fucking wolves if I can’t afford the rent. I am fighting the urge to walk off into the woods and fucking die of embarrassment at having accomplished so little at my age.
So no, I’m not really doing anything. I’ll cop to that. I’ve copped to worse, and at least for now I can live with being a hypocrite. Sorry if that’s unsatisfactory.
Are you feeling unsettled? How do you feel about all this mess?
I fucking HATE America, I fucking HATE world governments, and this just adds to the list of reasons why. Unsettled doesn’t even begin to cover it.
- demesisx ( @demesisx@infosec.pub ) English7•1 year ago
In the US, speaking the truth about the Israel-Palestine ::cough::Palestinian genocide::cough:: war will get you cancelled by AIPAC astroturfers and useful idiots who just cancel who they’re told to cancel. That’s how they (the AIPAC, the military industrial complex, and AIPAC-run film industry…if you don’t believe me, why was Harvey Weinstein so friendly with ex-Mossad agents that he was able to use them against his opponents?) manufacture consent among normal people these days.
Additionally, 35 US states have anti-bds laws on the books punishing US citizens that choose not to buy products from Israel. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-BDS_laws In many of those US states you can be fired from government jobs for refusing to buy Israeli products in your own personal life.
- MxM111 ( @MxM111@kbin.social ) 6•1 year ago
If you were in power in Israel, and care for its citizens, what would your steps be as reaction to what happened? Please imagine both short and long term consequences.
- masquenox ( @masquenox@lemmy.ml ) 4•1 year ago
and care for its citizens,
If the Israeli government cared about the people it (supposedly) represents it wouldn’t be turning them into violent colonialist goons to do the west’s bidding in the middle-east, would it?
You might just as well ask how to fix the Apartheid-regime without upsetting white people or fix the Nazi regime without discomforting Nazis.