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I think there is value in coining a term for a specific process like “enshittification” as rent seeking doesn’t describe the entire process.
From how they get users, to how they get vendors/advertisers their forsaking the users and finally the vendors then all that’s left is a husk that survives because it’s a monopoly.
While I understand the term is used to describe the second half imo the first half is integral because those are the steps that set up the monopoly, starving the market of competition.
Oh wait, hmm, no rent seeking adds nothing of value to the market where someone like amazon added value at one point but that took resources from aws to make it not operate at a loss, unless you see that as rent seeking
I guess my point was just that it seems counterproductive to focus on one hyper-specific market (tech), when this is a massive problem everywhere in one way or another.
Many people seem like they’re able to recognize this in the specific market they’re familiar with due to their work, or whatever, without being able to connect it to the bigger picture that this is everywhere, and not just a localized phenomenon. They don’t take the next logical step that, “maybe there’s something fundamentally wrong with capitalism,” because it seems like it’s just the failure of one market.
I see what you mean, i thought ‘enshittification’ was a universal term coined out of a more easily observable atmosphere.
Tech is just the sort of lightning rod that everyone is watching, if people read about a phenomenon in tech and recognize it in their personal lives then maybe they start to question the system of profit that is capitalism.
I agree, rent seeking doesn’t always cause enshittification, it can just be inflated prices. Rent seeking is also a process to try to create a “home” for your financial leeching, while Enshittification is more like bait users in with a product, entice businesses, screw over everyone and cash out.
“New” relatively speaking. I have read the article and am aware where the term came from. I just wouldn’t consider a term that Cory Doctorow made up back in January anything but “new”.
Anyway, my point is that this isn’t a new concept. Focusing solely on one super-narrow field like tech, when this is something that is happening nearly everywhere in capitalism, in nearly every market, does the problem a disservice. It betrays the reality of the situation by making it seem like something unique to tech. It seems like people are aware of this behavior happening in whatever hyper-specific market that they’re familiar with, yet so many seem unable to connect that to the larger picture that this is everywhere.
The Internet seems to have latched onto the idea that enshittification = tech decline, so you’re probably ‘too late’ to try to stop that flood. But, I’m open to having my mind changed. Can you describe any other industries where things started out great with a lot of user growth but slowly declined as competitors died out and corporations put the squeeze on their users? Are you thinking maybe Walmart as a more classic example, moving into an area and crushing small business before raising the prices, dropping the quality, etc.?
Yeah, for sure Walmart and other big box stores are a great example… It’s hard to even fathom what they’ve taken from us. All of the money that used to be re-invested into the community by local small business owners is now being extracted by massive corporations and taken elsewhere (usually to be hoarded). Not to mention the strain they put on our already threadbare safety net by underpaying their employees and then profiting even more when their employees use their food stamps at Walmart.
The Summer of enshittification continues apace.
No need to coin cute new terms like, “enshittification.” It is just good old rent seeking. Nothing new. Just capitalism working as intended.
I think there is value in coining a term for a specific process like “enshittification” as rent seeking doesn’t describe the entire process. From how they get users, to how they get vendors/advertisers their forsaking the users and finally the vendors then all that’s left is a husk that survives because it’s a monopoly. While I understand the term is used to describe the second half imo the first half is integral because those are the steps that set up the monopoly, starving the market of competition.
Oh wait, hmm, no rent seeking adds nothing of value to the market where someone like amazon added value at one point but that took resources from aws to make it not operate at a loss, unless you see that as rent seeking
I guess my point was just that it seems counterproductive to focus on one hyper-specific market (tech), when this is a massive problem everywhere in one way or another.
Many people seem like they’re able to recognize this in the specific market they’re familiar with due to their work, or whatever, without being able to connect it to the bigger picture that this is everywhere, and not just a localized phenomenon. They don’t take the next logical step that, “maybe there’s something fundamentally wrong with capitalism,” because it seems like it’s just the failure of one market.
I see what you mean, i thought ‘enshittification’ was a universal term coined out of a more easily observable atmosphere.
Tech is just the sort of lightning rod that everyone is watching, if people read about a phenomenon in tech and recognize it in their personal lives then maybe they start to question the system of profit that is capitalism.
I agree, rent seeking doesn’t always cause enshittification, it can just be inflated prices. Rent seeking is also a process to try to create a “home” for your financial leeching, while Enshittification is more like bait users in with a product, entice businesses, screw over everyone and cash out.
We’re not coining a new cute term, it’s been described in greater detail before, that applies specifically to tech: https://doctorow.medium.com/tiktoks-enshittification-bb3f5df91979
“New” relatively speaking. I have read the article and am aware where the term came from. I just wouldn’t consider a term that Cory Doctorow made up back in January anything but “new”.
Anyway, my point is that this isn’t a new concept. Focusing solely on one super-narrow field like tech, when this is something that is happening nearly everywhere in capitalism, in nearly every market, does the problem a disservice. It betrays the reality of the situation by making it seem like something unique to tech. It seems like people are aware of this behavior happening in whatever hyper-specific market that they’re familiar with, yet so many seem unable to connect that to the larger picture that this is everywhere.
The Internet seems to have latched onto the idea that enshittification = tech decline, so you’re probably ‘too late’ to try to stop that flood. But, I’m open to having my mind changed. Can you describe any other industries where things started out great with a lot of user growth but slowly declined as competitors died out and corporations put the squeeze on their users? Are you thinking maybe Walmart as a more classic example, moving into an area and crushing small business before raising the prices, dropping the quality, etc.?
Yeah, for sure Walmart and other big box stores are a great example… It’s hard to even fathom what they’ve taken from us. All of the money that used to be re-invested into the community by local small business owners is now being extracted by massive corporations and taken elsewhere (usually to be hoarded). Not to mention the strain they put on our already threadbare safety net by underpaying their employees and then profiting even more when their employees use their food stamps at Walmart.