The head of Telegram, Pavel Durov, has been charged by the French judiciary for allegedly allowing criminal activity on the messaging app but avoided jail with a €5m bail.
The Russian-born multi-billionaire, who has French citizenship, was granted release on condition that he report to a police station twice a week and remain in France, Paris prosecutor Laure Beccuau said in a statement.
The charges against Durov include complicity in the spread of sexual images of children and a litany of other alleged violations on the messaging app.
His surprise arrest has put a spotlight on the criminal liability of Telegram, the popular app with around 1 billion users, and has sparked debate over free speech and government censorship.
So to make it clear, it’s because their company actually holds some data for clients that these governments want access to - because telegram is not peer-to-peer, unless you set a chat to private.
In essence Telegram as a company holds a lot of data that the French authorities want access to…
This comment brought to you by the Signal gang.
If you want to continue using Signal, you should fight for the right of others to use Telegram. “First they came for them and I said nothing”. The EU and others are trying hard to control people’s private messaging.
It’s not a fight, it’s logic. The world governments can do nothing to OpenWhisperSystems (the makers of Signal), because they don’t store any communication.
Telegram however thought they were smart, by storing data and splitting that data up in to several different pieces around the world, assuming governments wouldn’t collude together to get it.
But they didn’t foresee the litigious nature of nation states, and that’s what we’re seeing now. If these nation states also start to collude with one another, everyone who thought they were safe are gonna get fucked.
Signal does not store any communication data. They only facilitate handshake between clients and the clients manage the data between themselves.
This is why Telegram isn’t safe, but Signal is.
They World governments want to ban Signal and make it illegal to use it. That’s the problem.
The wOrLd GuBmInTs is such a huge umbrella that it must mean it’ll rain the Atlantic Ocean.
WESTERN GOVERNMENTS are allowed to go against privacy and encryption because of stupid Karen’s screaming “won’t somebody please think of the children” and old fops going “basically terrorists” and not a single one of them have considered the decentralisation principle as an actual barrier, because their constituency allows it, because their constituency is technically illiterate.
EASTERN GOVERNMENTS are largely authoritarian. Sorry, world, but I’m not in the mood to piss about here.
THE GLOBAL SOUTH gets bundled together as well, because no one there has the resources to actually prevent the spread of encryption software, much to the shegrin of western governments, who tried to sanction that shit, but got overridden by people who took a plane ride with aa USB stick.
Again, PGP over email is still unbreakable and can be used as well, incl with private email servers, or even Matrix servers. You don’t need Telegram or Signal. The “whose next” problem relies on the idea that you and I are the only people who know of these problems, and that’s kind of arrogant.
M’buru Ufufu is on that plane right now, with tons of encryption software on a USB stick, the UN be damned. UMA LELE, UMA LELE~!
Just a side note: PGP doesn’t use any form for forward secrecy so if someone gets your keys you are hosed.
Better encryption out there these days.
True, but if you lose your keys you’re sort of screwed anyways. But yeah, forward secrecy ftw.
With forward secrecy the keys are destroyed after decryption. The messages then live on your device. If you delete those messages they are gone. Eve (the evil eavesdropper) can not decrypt stored encrypted messages even if they steal your device. The keys rotate and you can not generate previous decryption keys.
Even better: tell people about Briar. It isn’t for everyone but if people are really concerned it is the right answer. Briar has issues with convenience but that can be mitigated somewhat.
Signal fans are annoying Fuck
Quiet, youngin. I was there when the tracking algorithms that are currently canvasing your stupid ass was made. Listen to your elders.
shut up boomer
Imbecile.
Nobody is coming after Signal because nobody uses Signal. Telegram has a user base of almost 1 billion.
I think Signal is liked by the US government. I doubt it would be targeted. Also the US has laws protecting platforms.
Yeah. A lot of people use Facebook and TikTok too, yet here we are on Lemmy. How many users are there here?
I love lemmy, but it’s irrelevant on the big picture. Same with Signal.
Now do Zuckerberg and Musk
do you agree with this arrest or are you pointing out the double standards ?
I don’t really understand how he allowed crime. I can commit crime via sms, whatsapp, signal or mail. Does that mean they allow it?
I can commit crime via sms, whatsapp, signal or mail.
But you’re not allowed to
Crime is generally illegal
Against the law at the minimum.
I think the distinction here is that if your phone provider, WhatsApp, Signal or mail carrier is informed that someone is engaging in illegal activity using their service, these entities would comply and give the information they have on you-- be it a lot like SMS or a little like Signal (phone number, registration date).
In the case of Telegram, they’ve been informed countless times that specific individuals are engaging in blatantly illegal activity and unlike the previously mentioned entities, Telegram is refusing to comply with any legal requests.
I believe that’s the situation but if I’m wrong, by all means correct me because this is a very interesting subject.
Thanks, this is the first explanation that’s actually clicked for me.
Telegrams moderation leaves a lot to be desired. I’m not saying they should look into or give governments people’s private conversations but I am saying that certain public features of telegram that do allow you to report illegal materials have been used to spread them.
certain public features of telegram that do allow you to report illegal materials have been used to spread them.
I don’t understand, what do you mean? Does clicking “report” on a message not simply send a report to moderators only?
I’m saying that Telegram’s moderators are not moderating stuff they should be moderating and that they have admitted they should be moderating. I know that it’s not their fault, it’s the small size of the team compared to almost a billion monthly active users, but still.
I know that it’s not their fault, it’s the small size of the team
This part is directly Telegram’s fault. If they cannot keep up with their moderation queue then they need a bigger moderation team. Preferably properly remunerated. There are news reports about how Facebook’s sub-contracted moderators work for these extremely shitty companies who track them based on how many reviews a minute they do, and which causes extreme psychological damage to the workers both because of the extreme content they have to see as part of their jobs and the bad working conditions they must put up with.
Yes, basically every corporate social media site needs more moderators. A single person can barely moderate 200K users (cohost), so a platform with 900 million should probably have a trust and safety team larger than 30 or 60 (Durov didn’t confirm it).
I do wonder how much “report” does.
Next up: Discord!
Pretty sure Discord keeps tons of data on their users and readily complies with warrants.
I mean, they shut down tons of Yuzu and Yuzu clone discord servers for Nintendo.
I think they’re already in the good graces of those kind of folks.
Discord does not have this problem. Source: the US government and the issue of massive security breaches by people arguing in some discord chat
It is funny that his bail was a small fraction of his wealth. This situation is tense and uncertain but at least there is something funny about it.
You’re irrelevant IN the big picture, at least with that attitude. Defeatism is everywhere and prevents grassroots movements and is the sign of a weak spirit. I refuse that attitude and stick to the merits of a concept, rather than falling back on a logical fallacy like appeal to majority. Stop doing that, because that’s how you get subjugated, that’s how change is prevented, that is how those in power and influence remain in power and influence. Be the change you want to see.
EDIT: but yes, i was lost, as i thought i was answering to a comment in my inbox, but I did also find @MeetInPotatoes@lemmy.ml mom - and boy did I meet those potatoes, lemme tell ya.
Are you lost?
Naw, I found your mom’s room just fine.
You’re toeing this weird line between trying to act cool about the honest mistake (editing the post) while also acting like a lil removed that needed to overcompensate for the mistake. (lame mom jokes)
You do you and all, but man that’s fragile!! Most people would’ve just laughed and said “whoops!”
Yeah? I’m not most people.
Ummm…ok then, but in this case your individuality is making you look weak af.
If you say so.
Elder millennial, you little brat.