Some will cheer, some will be mildly disappointed. But I’m out, I think.
I don’t know who would cheer, you’re one of the pillars of this ecosystem as far as I’m concerned and even though I don’t say it enough I always appreciate your efforts in keeping so many niche subs fed with constant content.
I totally get how you’re feeling, and I can’t blame you for being burned out. You’ve put in an insane amount of work over the years. I hope you find some time to rest.
You will be missed, and will be remembered for a long time.
Count yourself lucky lol. I know several and they aren’t good people to know. But yes this will definitely make the new feeds a lot lighter. And traffic overall go down. Neither of which are great.
I haven’t seen anyone prolific on Lemmy not get hatred. Most of it I haven’t felt was justified.
Incidentally, I like your username.
I don’t know who would cheer
Hi 👋
Tbh makes little difference since I had him blocked, but if he uses the opportunity to finally touch grass, it’s a win-win.
Did you know about the part where his illnesses make touching grass an ordeal he reduces to the minimum necessary (politics, keeping up with friends)? I get that you won’t see his comments, but he said as much somewhere in this section.
Point is, he is touching grass and has plenty more opportunity. I don’t see why people are hating on someone contributing so much content, most of it high quality, and bringing life to the platform. Why would less activity be a good thing?
Did you know about the part where his illnesses make touching grass an ordeal he reduces to the minimum necessary (politics, keeping up with friends)?
What does that mean, exactly? There are lots of ways to touch grass that don’t involve physical activity any more intense than typing. Playing a board games with your friends is touching grass, for example.
Even if it were true that he had no choice but to be terminally online, his personality is insufferable, he digs in hard to his positions and can’t be reasoned with. I believe he’s had drama with trans spaces (something about neopronouns, it was a long time ago) before because of that sort of thing.
I believe my last conversation with him involved him screaming at me and calling me a fascist because I said that I wouldn’t believe claims without evidence. And then following me around calling me a fascist while still refusing to provide a shred of evidence for his claims. I suppose if you already agree with him on everything, you wouldn’t see that side, but from my perspective he doesn’t care about being persuasive or backing up his claims so much as playing to the crowd and shouting down disagreement.
Imo, comms like NCD are pure internet brain poison, “semi-ironic” glorification of the military with a veneer of liberalism. Likewise for the political compass and associated memes, it shapes the way people think about politics, massively oversimplifying everything.
Would be weird if an ml user liked him TBH
Like I said, he’s really just concerned with playing to a crowd that I’m not part of, so yeah.
What does that mean, exactly? There are lots of ways to touch grass that don’t involve physical activity any more intense than typing. Playing a board games with your friends is touching grass, for example.
Per https://feddit.uk/comment/26233735
“As someone with a laundry list of physical and mental ailments, my ‘touching grass’ time is extremely limit, and general I reserve the monumental effort there for important issues - like keeping up with the social events of my actual friends, or participating in local politics in my increasingly-fucked-and-fascist country. “Touch grass, it’s more fun than shitposting about history!” doesn’t really apply for me.”
As for the rest of your comment, I’ll be explicit in saying that I won’t engage with it. I have read the linked comments, their context, other comments linked in that context and frankly, I don’t think that will be a fruitful conversation for either of us. I hope you can respect that choice not to have it.
touching grass
All I’m saying is that, regardless of the reasons, too much internet can create brainworms, bad politics, and toxicity. I’ve yet to hear of any physical or mental ailment that makes it impossible to log off.
As for the rest of your comment, I’ll be explicit in saying that I won’t engage with it. I have read the linked comments, their context, other comments linked in that context and frankly, I don’t think that will be a fruitful conversation for either of us. I hope you can respect that choice not to have it.
Sure. You asked, I answered. I mostly linked them because I don’t believe in saying anything negative about a person without providing evidence.
He called you a fascist because it’s true. You are a genocide denier and simp for totalitarian regimes. It is even linked within the argument you linked.
I don’t just deny genocides, I deny literally everything that doesn’t have evidence to support it. Claiming that anyone who needs evidence to believe things is a “fascist” or a “simp for authoritarian regimes” is beyond absurd. Especially when the main proponent of the claim you’re demanding I accept blindly, without evidence, is itself an authoritarian regime!
How come do you come with the same talking points as neonazis/Holocaust deniers? (denying that evidence exists when you in fact deny the legitimacy of any evidence presented to you)
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Tankies will cheer, he was a big contributor to the TankieJerk comms which memed on and exposed them. He’s also frequently posted on MeanwhileOnGrad.
Basically there are two kinds of Anarchists on the fediverse: PugJesus and fake ones.
I agree with this guy, you are a pillar
but who will explain all the history memes
Please PugJesus, don’t leave us :(
Sounds like you’re saying you’re quitting threadiverse entirely? Sad to hear. I enjoyed your history stuff particularly
NO! Please! Say it ain’t so!
I think I might be out of the loop. What’s happening…?
There is a new rule metering the number of votes that can be cast by a user. You can see yours on your profile.
That’s… really weird.
On the surface the reasoning behind it makes sense, but there is also something about it (that I can’t quite point out yet) that rubs me the wrong way.
It doesn’t make sense though. It was presented as this unequal distribution thing where a few users cast the most amount of votes, but that really doesn’t matter because each user still only gets one vote per post or comment. No one’s opinion is outsized or disproportionate just because they vote on a lot of things.
It was really bad statistics from the start. It was framed sorta like wealth disparity, using the same kind of chart, but it’s categorically not the same thing.
but that really doesn’t matter because each user still only gets one vote per post or comment.
where does the policy change actually impact the user then? I guess at maximum we can’t upvote more that 240 things a day (comment or post). I think that’s more than the vast majority of users do per day, right?
The point isn’t about how many users are likely to hit the daily limit, the point is how having a daily limit might cause people to start rationing their votes. Instead of doling them out however they see fit, they might start thinking “hmm, but is this worth spending a vote on?”
Overall, that can have a chilling effect on voting in general, lowering engagement and reducing the motivation to post (if you only get a handful of upvotes on each post, it might feel “dead” and seem to have no point. It’s encouraging to see several dozen users like your post). And that can expand to a chilling effect on posting.
Also, if someone has a disability or is recovering from illness or surgery then they’re more likely to spend more time on here, meaning they’re more likely to reach the vote quota. This disproportionally impacts them.
Sure, 240 a day is high, but it’s not unreasonable for a human to reach, and it’s nowhere near “obvious bot” territory.
Based on the charts rimu shared, there are so few users who actually reach “obvious bot” territory that it’s impossible for them to not highlight themselves, and they should be easy enough to handle on a case-by-case basis. We’re talking less than 10 accounts. Admins can look at each one to examine their activity, and if they’re a bot they can remove the account.
There’s no reason to limit people’s votes.
i guess it’s an anti-botting measure where they can’t distinguish a power user from an automated system?
There are so few accounts that have that much activity on them that admins could easily handle them on a case-by-case basis.
This doesn’t get rid of the bot accounts, it only limits their voting activity like everyone elses, which will make them harder to detect.
I get that whilst also dancing on the idea that perhaps a power user shouldn’t post so much? This is decentralized social media, there really shouldn’t be an aim to maximise here: You post, you like, you don’t like.
If the aim is to farm engagement and thus a “power user” is born, then I suspect their motives or at least implore them to touch grass more often.
I’m making a lot of judgements here, and probably deserve any downvotes I get here - but if your posting habits are indistinguishable from a bot, then question your posting habits
Farming engagement has no incentive. It can’t be monetized here, there’s no karma. There would be no point.
Power users on the fediverse aren’t doing it for personal gain, they’re doing it to enrich the fediverse and make it a more attractive alternative to corporate social media.
We see so many complaints that it’s dead here, or there aren’t enough communities, or it’s hard to find the right community for something, or if the community exists it might be dead. That’s a lot of people’s rationale for not switching from reddit.
Power users here are trying to fix that. It’s an enormous task and more than a single user or a handful of users can do, but they’re doing their part and in many cases carrying more than their share of the burden. This change is kind of a slap in the face to them.
That’s the thing - Rimu openly admits that he doesn’t think that the power voters are bots. The issue isn’t distinguishing us. It’s just that Rimu doesn’t like so many votes being cast by so few users. Shit man, if I encounter two active discussions in a day (admittedly not a daily occurrence on the sometimes-sleepy Fediverse), I’ll be close to hitting the 240 limit simply by having an opinion on the majority of comments.
Shit, my vote quota is half-used-up today just from this comment section. I haven’t even posted or browsed anything else.
As someone with a laundry list of physical and mental ailments, my ‘touching grass’ time is extremely limit, and general I reserve the monumental effort there for important issues - like keeping up with the social events of my actual friends, or participating in local politics in my increasingly-fucked-and-fascist country. “Touch grass, it’s more fun than shitposting about history!” doesn’t really apply for me.
All social media pretty much operates on a 90/9/1 division. Only 1% of users actively post. Only a fraction of that 1% are power users like PugJesus. Killing power users won’t accomplish a different division of labour where more people post, it will only accomplish killing the ecosystem as a whole.
You thought the Fediverse was dead now? Wait until the power users disappear.
Yeah, I can’t seem to see what it accomplishes except to make the few users that reach it kinda mad. It seems like an experiment at best to see what kind of effect it will have on hot/all.
Wait, like total votes ever? Like you hit it and you can never vote again?? 😭
No, just over a set period of time.
Ohhh, that’s way more tolerable! Thanks for letting me know, got worried there lol.
I think it was YouTube back in the day that used to have a max number of total likes per account? After which, it would appear as if liking worked from your end, but it didn’t actually do anything on the backend. I was afraid we had one of those situations.
youtube still has a limit on upvotes, i am pretty sure it’s 5000. once you have 5k they remove your oldest ones.
This is correct at the moment. One can check by going to your their Liked Videos playlist.
Oof, I hate it…
I don’t get why the feature is necessary. Rimu should make it optional and not on by default.
It is optional in that each piefed instance can choose to turn it off, but its not per user.
WHAT?!*
Mate, who the hell cares about minor shizzle like that. Are you serious…?The combination of the irritation (being unable to upvote replies to your own material being particularly grating) and what it suggests about the future of the instance.
I actually planned on continuing to post as-usual (upvoting with alts, annoying as that would be) after I discovered it, but when the reasoning came out I knew it was the canary in the coal mine.
But… it was about a cap for those who chronically abused such…?
Man, I literally hit the cap before it was even announced. I went to the Matrix channel, confused as hell, and got told it was intentional.
The cap is 240 votes. I almost hit the cap just upvoting most of the comments here yesterday. If I participated in any real discussions outside of my own comms, I would almost certainly hit the daily cap on that given day.
The issue was not abuse, and Rimu didn’t say it was abuse in that sense. The issue was always that Rimu doesn’t think that a small minority should be more active in participating on here than the majority.
Sorry about my original reply on this one, mate. It sucked.
The cap is 240 votes. I almost hit the cap just upvoting most of the comments here yesterday. If I participated in any real discussions outside of my own comms, I would almost certainly hit the daily cap on that given day.
Damn, I certainly can’t imagine voting 240x in a single day. There might remotely be that number of opportunities in my subscribed stream, but that would be like me forming an opinion upon every-goldurn thing that I possibly saw in that day. And beyond, really?
I mean, sure I suspect I’m like you and others, giving a friendly updoot upon loads of stuff that I was only neutral upon, but it was for the ‘good’ of the FV, but… 240x per day, y’all?
Damn, I certainly can’t imagine voting 240x in a single day. There might remotely be that number of opportunities in my subscribed stream, but that would be like me forming an opinion upon every-goldurn thing that I possibly saw in that day. And beyond, really?
There are 303 comments in this post alone. If I have an opinion on 2/3s of them, I’m almost at the cap.
~300 comment posts are not the norm on the Fediverse, but I see a fair number of ~80 comment posts. If I run across two or three of them, suddenly I would have very few other opportunities to upvote.
Considering, on top of that, I post quite a bit and get a fair number of comments on each (I had ~90 comment replies to my posts on a pretty normal day’s output on HistoryMemes alone), it doesn’t take much browsing to hit 240 votes.
Rimu doesn’t think that a small minority should be more active in participating on here than the majority.
So it was a massive outrage, not worthy of the dev’s time to at least offer an explanation, and yet one more example of the right-wing dev / runner-path. Really?
All this on their own time, with hundreds of their free hours known and logged…?
So it was a massive outrage, not worthy of the dev’s time to at least offer an explanation, and yet one more example of the right-wing dev / runner-path. Really?
What?
At no point did I say that Rimu was right-wing in any sense or say that he shouldn’t have offered an explanation?
This is a shitty administration decision, it will have shitty effects on the instance long-term, and, especially, it affects me, personally, in a shitty way that I’m not willing to put up with. That’s it.
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Sometimes there’s only so many hours in a day. And so ultimately you have to make a choice whether that goes into moderation and maintenance, or development. Also remember that the fediverse isn’t generally paid to be run and addict more and more people. It’s a service for those who want to use it. Many of which don’t pay but give their participation.
I wonder if that will become a problem eventually - the few larger, better funded instances sponging up users from smaller ones that need to limit themselves, somewhat centralizing the fediverse.
Thankfully the way it’s designed there isn’t exactly a lot of reason to do that. As long as the contents are accessible from the instance I’m on and they don’t have me blocked etc. Then what does it matter if I’m on said instance? As long as the instance itself does what I need?
In Pug’s case they are a mass moderator and poster. Which for them presents different difficulties. Difficulties in both growing and feeding the community etc. Very different from the average user.
Though with a difference that multiple centers exist, rather than exclusively one.
Also for those of us in the USA there are so many other life-threatening additional considerations to add: e.g. if we join Piefed.ca then what happens when the USA decides to invade Canada, so either communication gets cut off or people who use this social media get rounded up onto a convention camp?
I am in the latter category: mildly disappointed. 😞
Maybe a little more than mildly, tbh 😭.
Fwiw Piefed.zip won’t have a voting limit added right away (source).
Great, thank for the info :)
Glad to have PyLova to counter Rimu’s desire to limit what users can do on PieFed.
How hard is it to just let people use software how they want. Anti-user design is so anathematic to the spirit of the Fediverse.
Nice! First time hearing of PyLova. Is that what quokk.au uses? Are there already any other instances powered by it?
Really sad over the direction PieFed takes, and this one sounds interesting.
Yes it’s what Quokk.au uses. From what I know a few other instances are looking at switching.
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rimu: provides a choice
smoothbrains: how dare rimu take away my freedom of choice
A choice to hard limit all users on .social to a number of votes he has determined to be sufficient.
Also let’s not use ablest language please.
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Yeah, apparently the limit was 2 inches
Ah, we’ll miss you. Your content is consistently some of the best out here.
The piefed admins are making a huge mistake with this change, and they’re basing it on bad statistical methods. Every user already only gets one vote per post or comment, so it really doesn’t matter if some users exercise that ability more than others. So framing it the same way as wealth disparity (literally using the same kind of chart) was not very insightful.
And to think I was considering switching to piefed soon… guess not anymore…
That would be decidedly tragic. Your history posts are basically the most interesting things on here. I think a lot of people will be more mildly disappointed, including myself, to see you go.
If you do leave, thanks for the time you were here. You have been appreciated!
I’m glad I didn’t jump over right away. I was going to, and then things started getting weird and uncomfortable with it.
Just wanted to let you know how appreciated you are. Yours is the only username I recognize honestly, and I know it’s going to be good shit when I see it.
I understand burnout though. Can’t fault you for wanting to care of yourself. I encourage it, actually.
edit: typos
I will miss your content, but if you need a break please go be healthy. Come back when it feels good again.
Nooooooo pls noooooo dear Pug, don’t leave us alone in these times :(
That being said, your own mental health is the most important thing you’ve got, so take care <3
