My old person trait is that I think ‘ghosting’ is completely unacceptable and you owe the other person a face-to-face conversation.

  •  Hot Saucerman   ( @dingus@lemmy.ml ) English
    84•1 year ago

    My old person trait is that none of the things mentioned in the linked image happened on accident.

    They happened because capitalism doesn’t give a fuck about anything except bleeding as much money as conceivably possible out of each and every human.

    1. Apps allow companies to suck more data out of your device than a website, allowing them to sell more of your data and… make more money.

    2. Video games needing access to the internet is simply Digital Rights Management and a way to prevent piracy and… make more money. Remember, most companies view something pirated as a “lost sale,” not that you would have never purchased it to begin with. As Gabe Newell once said:

    “We think there is a fundamental misconception about piracy. Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem,” he said. “If a pirate offers a product anywhere in the world, 24 x 7, purchasable from the convenience of your personal computer, and the legal provider says the product is region-locked, will come to your country 3 months after the US release, and can only be purchased at a brick and mortar store, then the pirate’s service is more valuable."

    1. This one speaks for itself. Being able to be in control of the products you buy is freedom. Having products controlled remotely by a corporation is giving them carte blanche to make more money off of you.

    2. Removing accessible customer service means more people will just give up on trying to get their problem solved, effectively allowing the company to steal from people and… shocker… make more money.

    I agree, in theory, in respect to ghosting, but we live in a society that teaches us to be isolated, and doesn’t teach interpersonal skills unless the interpersonal skill is “Fuck you, got mine.” (which is, not surprisingly, a thing about making more money.)

    In other words, these aren’t old people opinions. These are “I’m not gonna let capitalism absolutely fuck me endlessly” opinions.

      •  Hot Saucerman   ( @dingus@lemmy.ml ) English
        11•1 year ago

        Demos used to be everywhere back in the day! I think they have a huge impact, because it’s a way to try to play a game without dumping all the money on it without knowing what the gameplay is like and if its actually fun.

        When I was a kid, DOOM having the first episode of the game available as shareware was huge and I used to walk to my friends place after school and watch him play until he would get bored and let me play for a while.

        From an old interview in 1999 with John Carmack about this very subject (emphasis mine):

        Carmack: DOOM 2 was explicitly a commercial release. We sort of half heartedly did some shareware distribution with Quake, but I think the industry has almost unanimously decided that the three or so level demo is the best test vehicle.

        A lot of people consider themselves to have “finished DOOM” when they just finished the shareware episode.

    •  Percy   ( @Percy@lemmy.one ) English
      2•1 year ago
      • Well said, I’m going to save this for when my friends inevitably say something about it and I have to explain why the economy, expessially in the US sucks and why I might eventually leave
  •  nik282000   ( @nik282000@lemmy.ml ) 
    77•1 year ago

    I think cars should not be dependent on a touch screen for ANY of it’s functions (or really have one at all). They are more difficult to use than tactile buttons, distracting, and do not receive long term support from the OEM.

    What do you do with a 10 year old car that runs but the touch screen nuked due to age, firmware bugs or mechanical damage? Ford isn’t going to be selling replacement units 10 years later and I have yet to see an ‘infotainment’ system that has aftermarket replacement considerations.

    •  Indie   ( @Indie@lemmy.fmhy.ml ) 
      30•1 year ago

      Totally agree with this one.

      I drive an old 06 and I much prefer using the the physical buttons to adjust things like music, volume, air settings. Even prefer using it to back up and having to use my mirrors and look back.

      My '18 vehicle is all touch screen, cameras,etc. While the a/c functions better and I don’t feel like my fillings are going to fall out from all the rattles and bumps, I find there is a real disconnect. I am even asked by others why I lean over and look at the back window when reversing.

      I work in tech and I don’t trust tech.

    •  MrFunnyMoustache   ( @MrFunnyMoustache@lemmy.one ) 
      6•1 year ago

      One of the many reasons I am glad I don’t own a car. Touchscreens are only useful for navigation stuff, everything else should be with physical buttons so you could operate it without looking away from the road for even a fraction of a second.

    •  tatterdemalion   ( @tatterdemalion@programming.dev ) 
      2•1 year ago

      Yep. 100% agree. My new-ish Toyota RAV4 strikes an acceptable balance with touch screen vs real buttons/knobs. I don’t think anything critical is on the touch screen except maybe the equalizer. The touch screen isn’t massive either, but big enough to have a useful backup camera display.

    •  AnarchistArtificer   ( @AnarchistArtificer@slrpnk.net ) 
      7•1 year ago

      I was playing Sim’s 2 castaway recently on an emulator, because nostalgia, and when I was struggling to find an item in game, I googled for it and found some surprise bonus nostalgia: a guide to the game that was plain black text on white background, all on one page, with a chapter section and headings labelled, and ASCII art up top. It made me long for simpler days

      I also remember getting a cheat book with a gaming magazine, or very rarely getting access to a printer to print off cheats, or finding some online and writing the important ones down manually.

      I studied biochemistry in uni, and usually the practical labs had the protocols and stuff in a paper booklet we’d get at the start of term, but one year, they switched to using iPads for that. I hated it; it felt unhygienic, even though I was careful to avoid contamination, and it was awkward to flip back and forth between sections.

    •  JasonDJ   ( @JasonDJ@vlemmy.net ) 
      6•1 year ago

      They have their place but I totally get you.

      For example, when I’m planning a big home project, I want to watch a lot of DIY channels (plug for Home Renovision here) on the basic procedure.

      But, if I’m repairing my dryer, I don’t want to be unlocking my screen, rotating, hitting play, watch a few seconds, pause, put it down, work, repeat. Just give me something I can print out ffs.

    •  lemillionsocks   ( @lemillionsocks@beehaw.org ) 
      1•1 year ago

      Sometimes the video is a lot better because those old FAQ/Walkthroughs might be bad at describing things or gloss over some VERY important details.

      That said there are a lot of things that are better as text or articles with pictures. Like any guide for fixing something with technology, or hardware reviews are much better with just words and commands I can directly copy and paste if need be vs some damn 10 minute video thats way more annoying to navigate around.

  •  littlecolt   ( @littlecolt@lemm.ee ) 
    42•1 year ago

    As someone who works in a call center, screw that last person on here. So sorry you hate the automated system. Sorry you had to wait on hold. They can’t keep enough of us employed because y’all are fucking mean and no one wants to be abused for $15/hr.

    Er, I mean, Thank you for calling, sorry about your wait!

    •  evilgiraffe666   ( @evilgiraffe666@lemmy.one ) 
      19•1 year ago

      Don’t you think you could both be victims? Waiting for ages listening to a 13 second loop of music interspersed with “your call is important to us” might make people a bit more angry?

      You should be mad at the people who gain financially from it, and could make it better for you and the customers, but might have to skip that third yacht for little Timmy.

      •  interolivary   ( @interolivary@beehaw.org ) 
        6•1 year ago

        I understand that people get angry when they have to wait in line for ages and usually due to something having gone wrong in the first place, but dumping that anger onto a hapless call center employee who’s in many ways — like you said – also a victim of the same company is Not Cool™.

        •  Hot Saucerman   ( @dingus@lemmy.ml ) 
          5•1 year ago

          If I find myself feeling elevated by a company screwing me, I always start my call by telling the customer service agent that any frustration on my part isn’t directed at them, but at the company and their policies, things I understand they have zero control over. If they’re obviously foreign, I try to make clear that I think it’s an injustice that they’re paid less than their US counterparts and that I think they should be paid the US equivalent, because them being from another country does not make them any less of a human being deserving of basic respect and dignity.

          Usually, having gotten that spiel out of the way at the beginning of the call, they are pretty understanding and by the time I’m done explaining I’m less elevated. If you’re frustrated, it helps to keep in mind the power structures at play and direct your frustration and anger at the correct parties: the corporate suits who use customer service lines to screw with customers and avoid ever having to hear a customer complaint themselves.

          What I really want is the corporate phone numbers so I can call the fucking jackass CEO at home and direct my fuming fucking self-righteous anger right under his stupid worthless ass. Because I’m well aware that they record calls and don’t give one flying fuck about our complaints. They don’t listen, they don’t care. They’ll care when I’m blowing up their personal phone at 3am demanding them to fix the fucking issue.

          •  interolivary   ( @interolivary@beehaw.org ) 
            2•1 year ago

            Yeah same here.

            Also, turns out that when you treat customer service employees as humans, and communicate your frustrations and what caused them instead of jumping down the throat of an innocent service rep, you’re way more likely to get good outcomes. Who woulda thunk?

      •  littlecolt   ( @littlecolt@lemm.ee ) 
        5•1 year ago

        I have very little faith that a lot of these people would be any more pleasant. My time spent over the last year in the chat department at my company is a major reason why. Chat, unlike phone, has little to no wait time usually. But maybe something about written word makes people even more vitriolic.

        Of course I am upset at our staffing policies as well, and the company who is at the whim of the shitty investors.

    •  Waker   ( @Waker@lemmy.ml ) 
      10•1 year ago

      Worked in a call center for a long time and I somewhat agree with the last person.

      It’s often easier to deal with something with a real person. That is not the issue.

      The issue is people being polite and respectful. If everyone was a decent human being, call centers would be a good place to work and they wouldn’t be understaffed.

    •  pingveno   ( @pingveno@lemmy.ml ) English
      3•1 year ago

      I wish call center software had better features on dealing with overburdened staff. Callbacks are a great thing to avoid having to be on the phone constantly. A dash of statistics might be nice to recommend an alternative time to call to get a better wait time.

    •  potpie   ( @potpie@beehaw.org ) 
      2•1 year ago

      I was disappointed to learn that some companies set fucked up quotas for their customer service people. If you call to cancel, they can’t just process the request: they need to try to keep you, because they have to keep a certain number of cancellers each day. And in those situations and others like it, being polite seems to come off as susceptibility. It’s a system designed–it seems to me–to cause confrontation.

      I think we can safely blame the corporate overlords for this situation: set impossible goals for one side of the phonecall while pissing off the customer at the other. Whatever moves that needle, no matter how it dehumanizes people, no matter how big the CEO’s yacht already is.

  •  ikiru   ( @ikiru@lemmy.ml ) 
    40•1 year ago

    I think I should be allowed to order food from a restaurant without needing to scan a QR code which requires me to have a smart phone and an active, paid plan in order to access their menu.

  •  Calabast   ( @Calabast@vlemmy.net ) 
    37•1 year ago

    In regards to OP’s comment about ghosting, I just want to ask, are you a man? Because women all-too-often have to deal with men who can’t take no for an answer, and some of those men go from mad to violent very quickly. You might say “well, no man should act that way, they should be able to hear ‘I don’t want to see you anymore’ and just accept it and move on” but the fact is they are not all able to do that. So should women do the respectful thing and stop ghosting, even though some of them definitely WILL end up being yelled at/attacked/killed?

    (I know my example doesn’t cover all situations involving ghosting, like for instance if the ghoster is a man. If you want to modify your claim to be ‘ghosting is unacceptable, except in cases where having a face-to-face conversation could put someone in danger’ then I guess I’d agree with that statement. It’s just that it’s really hard to know which person will be dangerous when they are turned down.)

    •  tchotchony   ( @tchotchony@mander.xyz ) 
      15•1 year ago

      Yeah, at the very least scratch the “face to face”. I’d be more inclined to agree if a message or a call is acceptable, but some guys you really, really don’t want to see in person a second time.

    •  Trash Panda   ( @raccoon@lemmy.ml ) 
      11•1 year ago

      I’ll offer the other side of the coin just to give more food for thoughts, but I will also add that unlike OP I believe a phone call or a polite text would be enough: Should someone ghost in the name of safety, when a dangerous person would still look for you in person anyway or should they consider the feelings of someone they don’t like just because they don’t know they are a decent human being?

      I understand where you’re coming from, but a phone call or a message will keep you safe from a beating or being yelled at, homeboy starts yelling? Block the number. If you ghost someone they might still get really angry and look for you in person, maybe I’m ignorant and stupid but I don’t see a lot of extra safety in ghosting unless we assume that to tell someone you’re not interested you have to do it in person.

      If you ghost someone there is a chance you avoid their anger, a chance. But there’s also 100% certainty that you’re going to hurt someone’s feelings. Not to mention I do believe that’s not the only cause, there’s definitely people that ghost because they just don’t care about the other person.

      •  Spaceman Spiff   ( @Nollij@lemmy.fmhy.ml ) 
        4•1 year ago

        There’s a wide spectrum of responses people can have to a breakup. Anger to the point of violence is naturally low in most modern societies, but it does exist.

        When you have that breakup moment in person, you force a lot of emotions to flood them all at once. Often, they thought things were going well. This creates a strong sense of rejection, hurts their self-esteem, and puts them immediately on the defensive. It can also trigger a fight-or-flight response, and manifest as anger.

        Ghosting flattens the curve. Over the course of days or weeks, the ghostee more gradually recognizes and comes to terms with the fact that the ghoster is no longer interested in them. This often happens without there being a flashpoint moment to set them off.

        It’s still rude, but I absolutely see the value in it

    •  Spaceman Spiff   ( @Nollij@lemmy.fmhy.ml ) 
      9•1 year ago

      Face to face is not only unnecessary, but often counter-productive. You aren’t likely to just already be at the same place, so one or both of you must travel to the agreed upon meeting place, just to deliver the bad news. It also often forces an unwanted and pointless conversation, and draws out what may be a painful subject for both people. And this assumes that it goes well- others have mentioned the risk of violence, extreme emotional distress, etc.

      I (generally) oppose ghosting, but it can be done remotely.

    •  Lumi   ( @lumi@beehaw.org ) 
      2•1 year ago

      There’s also the fact that you can communicate (therefore not ghost) in ways other than face-to-face. If someone is dangerous or makes me uncomfortable, I’m not putting myself in that situation, but sending a message is courteous.

      I also wonder if there’s an expectation of time investment in OP’s face-to-face comment. If I’ve been chatting with someone on an app, or had one date but didn’t hit it off, I think a text is perfectly acceptable and doesn’t count as “ghosting” either.

    •  lauha   ( @lauha@lemmy.one ) 
      6•1 year ago

      Your old person trait is that modern UI should follow the same sane UI design guidelines as theybused to in the past. In your example, the UI elements should not move around unexpectedly. :)

      I agree with you whole heartedly.

      •  TWeaK   ( @TWeaK@lemm.ee ) 
        3•1 year ago

        Not even that so much. I mean, I get that UI needs to adapt to the screen size it’s being displayed on, rather than older sites that would end up malformed on different displays.

        All I ask is that the page figure all that shit out before it displays anything to the user. Figure out where it wants to put the buttons, then put the buttons there. That, and get rid of bullshit slow animations that only exist so that a web designer can showcase to their client, rather than accept input from the users. “Look how smooth it slides out when you hit that button!” Fuck that, I just want to click the next button as soon as possible - and ideally minimise the number of clicks to get to what I want.

        Saying that though, I do have a soft spot for old Unix systems. The kind that were kind of slow loading pages, but if you knew what the page contained you could press a bunch of keyboard keys and go through and queue up instructions for page after page. It would take a few seconds for the computer to catch up with your input, but it would process it all and you’d end up where you wanted to be.

        People shouldn’t be waiting for computers, computers should be working to make work easier for the user.

      •  TWeaK   ( @TWeaK@lemm.ee ) 
        2•1 year ago

        It should pause when your mouse hovers over. I mean, google already monitor that kind of shit with all their ad scripts and crap, the least they could do is pass on some benefit to the user.